by Atasha McMillan

conducted 6 November 2003

Historian and best-selling author Laurence Gardner discusses the powers of white powder gold,

the Ark of the Covenant, the Knights Templar and his new sci-fi screenplay cantered around the Shroud of Turin.
Extracted from Nexus Magazine

Volume 11, Number 4 (June-July 2004)




Since his latest book, Lost Secrets of the Sacred Ark, was published in February 2003, best-selling author Sir Laurence Gardner has been giving worldwide lectures about the rediscovery of arcane knowledgeóin particular, the extraordinary powers of white powder gold.

When gold and platinum-group metals are transformed into the monatomic state, a fine white powder is produced. This substance was used by pharaohs and kings of the ancient world. It was also part of the secret knowledge of mediaeval alchemy and the Knights Templar. Research on this has been forging ahead, and some amazing properties of high-spin monatomic elements have now been scientifically confirmed.

This has huge and potentially revolutionary implications. Humanity now has within its reach a potential cure for cancer without drugs or surgery, an environment-friendly alternative to fossil fuels, a means to transform human consciousness, the possibility of low or zero-gravity flight, space travel by manipulation of space-time, and access to other dimensions (which scientists have now proved to be real).

In this interview conducted at Growing Needs Bookshop in Glastonbury, England, Laurence talked about some of the latest developments in this field. We began by discussing how news of its use as a cure for cancer has begun to spread to the mainstream environment.

ó Atasha McMillan




















Laurence Gardner (LG): Iíve been talking about gold as an effective catalyst in cancer treatment for a long timeóand it is now happening. The World Gold Council is confirming this in its literature, and the Securities & Exchange Commission, Washington, DC, is now publishing it in its bullion prospectus. The S&EC also reports on other aspects that I have written about in the past. Future applications for gold, it says [reads from S&EC prospectus], "are in pollution control, clean energy generation and fuel cell technology. In addition, work is under way on the use of gold in cancer treatment".

Atasha McMillan (AM): Are the research tests for this being done mostly in America?

LG: Theyíre being done all over. Scientific journals from Switzerland, Germany, Italy, Spain, France, Singapore, Israel, Britain and America are all commenting in this regard, with headlines such as "The Amazing Properties of Monatomic Gold". There are no limitations on this now. Singapore University is making great progress with gold in cancer treatment, and Rice University, Texas, has reported amazing success in recent remedial trials with nano-gold.

AM: Youíve said that monatomic elements can be used in connection with space travel. Can you explain a bit more about that, and about how research in that area is progressing?

LG: Monatomic transition-group elements were classified some time ago as "exotic matter" because they have a negative energy density and the ability to manipulate space-time. Physicists now say that exotic matter is the key to traveling enormous distancesóseemingly faster than the speed of light, but with an acceleration rate of zero. They are looking at the concept of moving the space instead of the spacecraftóthat is to say, contracting space-time in front of the ship, with a commensurate expansion of the space-time behind it. NASAís Breakthrough Propulsion Physics Project is leading the research in this regard. We also have the aircraft industry investigating the concept of antigravity flight. Monatomic elements are operative high-temperature superconductors, and superconductors will levitate. They have a null magnetic field and will repel external magnetic fields. The Center for Advanced Study in Illinois has classified superconductivity as "the most remarkable physical property in the universe".

So, as the UK Ministry of Defense has stated, "Anti-gravity propulsion is now coming out of the closet". In this arena, Boeing is working on Project Grasp at its top-secret Phantom Works in Seattle, and British Aerospace has its parallel Project Greenglow. There is also a new UKĖUS joint venture called Project Falcon. Back in August [2003], British Aerospace and Boeing met at the Pentagon to talk about their plan for a 6,000-miles-per-hour aircraftóthatís around five times the speed of the now redundant Concorde.

AM: You have also mentioned the prospect of teleporting matter from one place to another.

LG: Yes; nanophysics and monatomic sciences are now leading us into some astonishing new realms. NASA and the Ohio Aerospace Institute are talking about teleportation as if itís just around the corner. By the use of coupled quantum systems, theyíll soon be able to teleport matter instead of moving it physically. "By this means," they say, "even people could be transported by sending enough classical information."

So, by the time we get round to the kind of high-speed antigravity aircraft they think they can produce, we might not even need aircraft! In fact, they say that a digital cloning process is also possibleómeaning that we could actually be in more than one place at the same time!

AM: And yet the ancient people knew about these things?

LG: They certainly knew about monatomic elements and superconductors, even if they didnít understand the science behind them. There were various names and terms for these phenomena in different cultures. As for the scientific aspects, maybe they didnít know specifically that these magical powders resonated with DNA or that they were immune system enhancers but they undoubtedly knew of their healing and anti-ageing properties. They also told of levitation, movement into parallel dimensions, communication with gods, and the like. In so many instances, their descriptions were commensurate with modern scientific discoveries; they just used different terminology. They might not have known precisely what they were dealing with, but they clearly knew about the substances in action.

AM: You said at a recent lecture that monatomics could improve memory and learning abilities.

LG: Absolutely. In fact, some remarkable tests were conducted last year by the Alphalearning Institute at the World Trade Center in Lugano. They are specialists in behavioral sciences and learning deficiencies such as dyslexia and ADHD. Over a number of weeks, they gave measured doses of monatomic supplements to ten volunteersómales and females of varying ages. The results were quite staggering. Their EEG brain scans showed a significant enhancement of alpha waves, leading to perfect hemispheric left and right brain synchronization.


This facilitates heightened learning ability, memory and creative skills, and a substantial lowering of the stress factor. Their report stated that the results were both immediate and cumulative, while being a significant aid in exam-type situations, whether mental or physical.






AM: Was the Ark of the Covenant connected to the white powder of gold?

LG: Yes; it was all part of the same sequence in Exodus óthe events at Mount Sinai, when Moses burnt the golden calf and turned it into a powder that he fed to the Israelites.

AM: Do we know where the Ark went?

LG: Well, from Sinai, it was eventually taken to Jerusalem and placed in the Templeís holy sanctuary.

AM: Some people say it was stolen by a son of Solomon and Sheba, and taken to Ethiopia.

LG: That was a concept which arose in a 13th-century book called the Kebra Nagast ("The Glory of Kings"). It was designed to cement a Judaic history for the new royal dynasty in Ethiopia, but it was entirely fictional. It works quite well for the modern Ethiopian tourist industry, whose representatives say they have the Ark locked away in a crude 1960s building at Aksum. But no one has ever seen itónot even the Patriarch of the region. Itís just a story. What they actually have there is a manbara tabotóa casket that contains a venerated altar slab. They carry this through the streets annually, beneath a draped cloth.

AM: Where did the Ark go then?

LG: In biblical terms, it remained in Jerusalem for many generations after King Solomon. It is mentioned repeatedly throughout the Old Testament to the time of the invasion by Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon. The Ark was then hidden by Hilkiah, the High Priest, before the Temple was destroyed in around 586 BC.

At that time, the Captain of the Temple Guard was Hilkiahís son Jeremiah, whom we generally think of as a prophet. Prior to the Babylonian invasion, Hilkiah instructed Jeremiah and the Guard to hide the great treasures of Jerusalemóthe Ark, the Anointing Stone, etc. In the main, they were secreted in tunnels beneath the Templeóexcept for the Stone, which Jeremiah subsequently carried westwards. In Ireland it became the anointing stone of the Scots kingsóthe Stone of Destiny, transported by the kings to their new-found Scotland in the fifth century.

Anyway, a record was kept of those items hidden beneath the Temple. This record was retained within the Order of the Temple Guard, who were in effect the original Knights Templar. Then, around 1,700 years later, the Templars were reconstituted from French and Flemish knights after the First Crusade. They established their base in the Mosque, which then stood on the old Temple site, and excavated to bring up the treasures. They knew exactly what they were looking for, and where to look.

Interestingly, they left their own relics for a future generation. In 1894, from beneath the Temple of Jerusalem foundations, British military engineers brought up 11th- and 12th-century Templar swords, crosses and various items from way down below the El Aqsa Mosque. So there is no doubt that the Templars were there. Their patron, Bernard de Clairvaux, recorded their homecoming in 1127. They were protected en route, he said, by a military guard to safeguard them from papal interference.

Once returned to France, the Templars became the most powerful organization the world has ever known. They were both influential and wealthy, establishing the Western banking system on the Islamic model. They were bankers to just about every royal court in Europe and, in time, developed the concept of insurance companies in Scotland. At the same time, they became the primary ambassadors to the Middle East.

The biggest of all projects that the Templars undertook was the building of the great Gothic cathedrals in Franceóthe Notre Dame cathedrals. Even today, architects are in awe of the extensive, unsupported roof spans. Many still claim that in theory they are impossible.

AM: How did they do it?

LG: Well, we know that cathedral stones are highly paramagnetic, and that the Gothic arch design further aids the antigravity thrust of the buildings. Certain granites, sandstones and other rock types are also high in monatomic elemental content, and we know that these elements have levitative qualities óespecially if subjected to strong magnetism or frequencies, which repel them. Bluestone granite, as at Stonehenge, is a good example of a stone that can react in some opposition to gravitational thrust.

Stonehenge, Herodís Temple, the Giza pyramids and the Gothic cathedrals all fall into a category of "How did they do it?" They all contain gigantic blocks of enormous weight, carried to impossible heights and difficult locations. Even modern cranes would find such constructions hard to replicate. But none of this is impossible if one is dealing with stones that can be triggered to react against gravity and Earth magnetism, somehow pushing away and thereby reducing their physical weight.

It has been noticed in Templar constructions, Chartres Cathedral in particular, that people walk taller inside the buildings than they do outside. They actually stand more erect ópushing upwards, so to speakó in the confines of these magical edifices.

AM: Why did the Church oppose the Templars?

LG: If they were capable of such techniques, if they knew about monatomic elements and gravity, and if they also had the Ark of the Covenant, itís hardly surprising that they became feared by the Pope and the European monarchs. Their patron, St Bernard, was a Cistercian abbot and, apart from the cathedrals, loads of Cistercian abbeys were also constructed during the same era. So there is no doubt that the Templar/Cistercian building methods were fast as well as awesome. Itís also apparent why the Catholic Church was so resentful of the monks of Bernardís Order, who eventually linked up with the more ancient Celtic Church in Scotland.

They were in the final throes of building the cathedrals when the Papal decree went out against them in 1307. They were kicked out of France and the rest of Europe, and under papal edict were to be persecuted in all Catholic countries. England was predominantly Catholic at that time, but Scotland wasnítóso many of the Templars went to Scotland under the protection of Robert the Bruce. In 1317 he established a new Order as a cover for Templars when traveling abroad. They were known as the Elder Brethren of the Rosy Cross. It was the original Rosicrucian fraternity.

AM: I see from your website that you belong to the Knights Templar of St Anthony. What kind of role do the Templars play in our world now?

LG: The Knights Templar of St Anthony is the oldest legitimate historical order of Templars still in operation. It was founded for Mary Queen of Scots when she came to Scotland after being Queen of France, and is still under the protectorate of the Royal House of Stuart. In the reign of Maryís son, King James VI, they built King Jamesís Hospital in Edinburgh and The Royal Hospital at Leith.


In essence, they were a socially orientated fraternity with Scottish interests at heart. Itís much the same today, really. The Order is still concerned with Scottish traditions, culture, education and heritage.






AM: So when the Pope hounded the Templars out of France in 1307, did they take the Ark of the Covenant with them to Scotland or somewhere?

LG: The last historical record of the Ark is at Chartres Cathedral, where a relief inscription on an entrance pillar says, "The Ark of the Covenant was yielded from here". There is no record of it ever having left that place. It was not buried there, taken from there or sent anywhere from there. The word used is "yielded", which means "given up" or "let go". I have discussed this aspect of the Arkís history in Lost Secrets of the Sacred Ark and have presented an hypothesis. It seems perhaps a little far-fetched but, knowing what we now know about superconductors and monatomic elements, it is a feasible possibility.

AM: You think it was moved into another dimension?

LG: Yes, I think so. And when you look at the cathedralís original construction, the set-up could have been right for this. Seventeenth-century documents from the Acadťmie FranÁaise and the Royal Society in London relate that there was a great golden plate in the middle of the famous Chartres labyrinth. Today there are just the cut brass studs which held it in place. Also, there was a magical stone of some sort in the roof space above it. This was lost in the debris of the roof fire in 1836, but was originally placed there for some specific purpose by the Templars. If it were perhaps a stone of monatomic iridium crystal or some other energetic superconductive device, it could well have been triggered to the transition-group metal below in order to create a flux-tube portal between them.

We know that the Ark was a very powerful capacitor and, in conjunction with monatomic elements (the manna placed in the Ark), it could become a superconductor with its own Meissner field. Hence, as detailed in the Torah and Talmud, it would levitate above the ground. We also know from recent experiments with monatomic elements that they can be heat-triggered to move out of our space-time. Bringing these things all together, therefore, it is possible that the Ark is still at Chartres, but simply not in our space-time ómaybe "yielded", for want of a better term, into another parallel dimension.

AM: Things can actually be sent into other dimensions?

LG: Yes, and brought back. Hal Puthoff, the director of the Institute for Advanced Studies in Austin, Texas, wrote in a report some years back that when particles begin to resonate in two dimensions, they should lose 4/9ths of their weight [see "Gravity as a Zero-point Fluctuation Force", Physical Review A 39(5), 1 March 1989].

Subsequent tests with monatomic elements revealed that they, too, would lose 4/9ths of their weight during thermo-gravimetric analysis. With increased heating, the weight would reduce to absolute zero óat which point they disappeared altogether. On subsequent cooling, however, they would return to a visible state.

We know, therefore, that itís possible to transport matter into other dimensions. What we donít know is the key to unlocking the Ark óif indeed it is there to be unlocked. Maybe it was triggered by a sound wave, maybe a light wave; but either way we would need to know the resonance frequency. As I said, itís just an hypothesis, but it is a possibility. In a way, itís the sort of thing that NASA and others are now working on with regard to the teleportation of matter, as we discussed earlier.

Interestingly, Royal Arch Freemasonry óor Royal Ark, as it used to beó is firmly centered on the traditional mystery of a sacred keystone and a golden plate.






AM: Is Arch the same as Ark, then?

LG: In a certain context, yes. The Greek word ark, meaning "gathering box", is arc in English and arche in French. The Oxford Word Library defines the word ark as an obsolete form of the modern English word arc. It was equivalent to the Latin arca, a "chest", "box" or "coffer". Archaeology was about a quest for the Ark. Storage places are called archives. Ancient mysteries are called arcane. Ark-based construction, as used by the Templars, became known as architecture, from which we also get arch, architrave, etc. Masonic lore was based on arcane architectural geometry, and the term Royal Arch or Ark stemmed from this.

In Lost Secrets of the Sacred Ark, Iíve included a color plate of Templars in 1147, twenty years after they returned from Jerusalem. The painting, from the Ch‚teau de Versailles, depicts them with the Ark of the Covenant at the Paris Chapter House.

AM: An idea that goes round a lot is that the world is really ruled by secret societies. What do you think of that?

LG: I donít really see that as being the case. There are societies, fraternities and establishments which are secretive, and many of our prominent leaders belong to them, but I donít see the groups themselves as running anything. They just provide venues of mutual interest at which to meet. For example, one might say that numerous of our governors are Freemasons. By implication, therefore, we are governed by Freemasonsóbut that does not mean their individual or combined lodges control the world. They do not. I know many politicians who are members of the British Library and indeed often meet there. But that does not mean we are ruled by a cabal of book readers. I have been a Freemason and a British Library member, but Iíve never controlled anyone.

AM: So, are you a Freemason?

LG: Not any more. For many years I was affiliated with the City of London financial sector, and it was part of the scene to belong to a City lodge. It was just the same as being expected to fraternize in this or that wine bar. Business and trades people do much the same at a provincial level, belonging to the local Rotary Club, Round Table or whatever. They all provide venues for those with common interests, but these associations do not run the world óeven if some of their individual members have a hand in that regard. If a Scout leader happens to run someone down in his car, it doesnít mean that the Scouts are training terrorists! It simply doesnít work that way.

Anyway, after some twenty years in Freemasonry, I resigned in 1984ómainly because I got thoroughly bored with it all. I had expected to learn such a lot, but actually learned nothing of much consequence except how to perform ceremonial ritual. I suppose if one wants somewhere to be every Monday night and a group of people to be with, then it provides a suitably fraternal environment. But, in the end, I found better things to do.

All I really discovered in terms of "secrets" was that their biggest secret is that theyíve forgotten what their secrets are! Even the ritual maintains that the true secrets of the Craft were lost long ago. What I never experienced was anything covert in the way that one imagines a secret society. So, either it wasnít there, or it was very cleverly concealed from me for twenty years.

There are, however, secretive aspects of government that I really donít like. Elected politicians are supposed to represent and report to their electorate, not keep secrets from them.

Take the Bilderberg Group, for example. Industrialists, bankers and whoever are perfectly entitled to meet and discuss things which they are not required to disclose publicly afterwards. We all have such meetings in our daily lives, but donít feel the need to broadcast everything weíve discussed with our colleagues.

What I object to is that our elected representatives do attend such meetings, but then consider their electorate irrelevant óperhaps keeping secret certain information which they should pass on. Maybe they feel that insider knowledge gives them an edge for their power base. But that really bothers me. Do they emerge in a position whereby theyíre working for themselves and their colleagues, and not necessarily for us? Iím pretty sure thatís often the case.

So, itís a matter of getting those in positions of elected influence to recognize that their responsibility is to be servants of society and not to lord it over society.

AM: How do you think that could be managed?

LG: We keep hearing these politicians issuing statements such as, "And when we came to power..." Power! Who gave them power? They represent us. We appoint them. We pay their salaries. I think the whole political structure needs to be reviewed. Throughout the so-called democratic world, we have allowed a reversal of the way things are supposed to be. We ask for guardianship, protection and economic management, but they give us laws, restrictions and controls. They totally ignore national written constitutions which "belong" to the people and whose terms and conditions they are supposed to uphold.

But whose fault is that? It is our fault. We have allowed it to happen. What we have to understand is that the politicians will not change unless we make them change. Itís our car, and they are our chauffeurs. What we want is an adequate ride, not to be told how to sit.

Nor do we want them keeping secrets ólike, weíre going to run out of gas at the next turn. But, as I said, they wonít change voluntarily from a position that suits them. We have to change them by making our demands fully apparent.






AM: What do you think of the Paul Burrell book about Princess Diana thatís recently come out?

LG: Iíve read some of it. And Iíve read bits and pieces serialized in the press. From what I can see, there doesnít seem to be much thatís new or unexpected. What is interesting is that itís coming from a close-to-home, in-house perspective rather than from an outside biographer.

AM: Do you think Burrell is telling the truth?


LG: I have no reason to doubt it. I donít see that he has any particular, underhand motive. I think perhaps, if he had been treated differently by the Establishment, he might have thought twice about some of the content. But, under the circumstances, he clearly decided to publish anyway. Iíve not seen anything particularly offensive against the Royal Family in his work. In fact, itís taken the edge off things to some extent. Many people were looking quite harshly at Prince Philip, for example, whereas, according to Burrell, Philipís relationship with Diana wasnít that bad.

What I do like about Burrellís book is that it has, once again, prevented the Princess from being conveniently airbrushed from the historical scene, as many would prefer.

AM: So thatís the Burrell book. How would you describe your own writing motivations?

LG: I feel that, because of what I research and write, I have a particular responsibility to the readers of my work. This means that when I discover interesting or important things I feel obliged to pass on the information. So thatís my primary consideration. Apart from the fact that I enjoy my work, I have the advantage of being a totally free agent. I am not running for any office, nor bound to any masteróso the only people I need to please are my readers.

AM: Where do you do all your research? Is it all publicly available?

LG: Thereís very little that isnít publicly available. And if it isnít, I make it publicly available by writing it. The main problem is not lack of accessibility, but of how easily accessible some things might be. I might find something thatís available in some monastery in Tibet óso itís publicly available, but how accessible is that for you? Researching and writing is what I do, just like other people are lawyers, carpenters or whatever. So, I just get stuck in and work at it, following the leads like a detective of sorts, trying to discover "who done it and to whom".

AM: Do you have any idea what youíre going to do next?

LG: Each book in my Grail series has been designed to answer the most asked questions that arose from the previous one. So Iíll be continuing on the same basis. Iíve been traveling a lot during past months, but am planning to write the next book this year. In previous editions, I have dealt with Grail-related religion, history, mythology and science. The next book will look more closely at philosophies such as the Grail Code and Kabbalah. Also, a lot has happened on various scientific fronts since I wrote Lost Secrets, so Iíll be including some updates in this regard and very possibly getting back into some of the sacred geometry that I introduced in the first edition of Bloodline of the Holy Grail.

Right now, however, I am currently involved with the making of a Hollywood movie based on Lost Secrets of the Sacred Ark. We are casting now and should begin shooting in the summer, so that will be pretty time-consuming this year. It has also been suggested that I should write a novel to parallel the film. So thatís another possibility if I have the time.

AM: What kind of film is it?

LG: The Hollywood Reporter has classified it as a "sci-fi adventure", which just about sums it up. Itís an action thriller, based essentially in modern Los Angeles, but embodies many scientific aspects from Lost Secrets: time warping, parallel dimensions and the like. In general terms, it concerns the historical and current aspects of monatomic elements, but within the wrap of a fictional story.

AM: Can you tell us anything about the story?

LG: Thereís a related page on my website, with a link to the production companyís site. Basic information and progress updates are being posted as we go. Currently, thereís a scene-setting video trailer online, prepared by Living Element Pictures of Los Angeles, but this will be replaced with something more directly representative in time.

The film is currently under the working title, The Christian, and the basic format for the story is given as follows [he reads from a promotional poster]: "Since the inception of the DNA Crime Lab in San Diego, California, over 592 crimes have been solved by DNA match. But one puzzling case remains a mystery. May 16, 2003óa 30-year-old white male, identified only as Chris Doe, was arrested on burglary charges in LA County and later released on $1,000 bail. Chris Doe has a positive DNA match to the Shroud of Turin. He is now wanted for questioning by the authorities and by the scientific community."

AM: I read an interesting book called The Second Messiah, which says that the image on the Shroud of Turin is really of Jacques de Molay.

LG: Thatís a book by Christopher Knight and Robert Lomas óone of a number of suggestions about the Shroud. Others reckon it might be Leonardo da Vinci. Various ideas have been put forward over the years, but the traditional view is that the Shroud was the burial cloth of Jesus. The weave of the cloth and the type of material are certainly old enough, and pollen has been found embedded which is undoubtedly Syrian. At present, no one really knows the true origin of the Shroud, and even scientists argue about various aspects of its analysis.

For our film purposes, however, we are concerned only with the DNA analysis of the blood embedded in the cloth, and with the blood group. These have been specifically identified, and the DNA tests were done in the 1990s at the University of Texas. The information is actually held on file by the San Diego DNA Crime Lab, so it ties in rather well with our screenplay.






In a recent email about this film project, Laurence said:

"All is going well to the extent that the film producers have now also optioned my other three books. It rather looks now as if screenplays will become very much a part of my life as well as writing books."