The other thing that I'm connecting in The Biggest Secret - and more and more people are beginning to do this- is the
connection between the Earth and Mars, because it seems to me that
the cataclysms which destroyed so much of the Earth, which the
geological record, as well as the ancient legends and accounts talk
about, the massive cataclysms, probably one that destroyed what
became known as
and there were later ones, too, were the same cause of that cataclysm,
some renegade or out-of-control celestial body of some kind actually
I'm just reading books about
compilations of the evidence that's been gathered about Mars,
and there is tremendous evidence that Mars was actually a
planet with an atmosphere very much like the Earth's, in the very
near past, certainly the last 20,000 years, even 10,000 years,
possibly. And, I think there was a tremendous connection between a
civilization on Mars and the Earth, and when this cataclysm
destroyed Mars, the surviving "Martian" people,
who could - well, I suggest, be what we call the White race today,
genetically - actually came and settled here and re-emerged,
eventually, as the Sumerian culture, the Egyptian
culture, and those great civilizations of the ancient world.
Interestingly, the connections between their symbolism, their deities,
their legends, and the
planet Mars are absolutely
extraordinary. So, there is something big-time to look at there.
And what Arizona Wilder has said, in that in her
preparation and training to conduct the rituals, because she was
obviously a Cathy O'Brien-type,
multiple-personality-created-robot to do these rituals, she said,
what she was told by the insiders during her training was that the
White race and this reptilian race have actually been at
war with each other for a long, long time, not just on planet Earth.
And that somehow the reptilians want more than anything the
blond-haired, blue-eyed genetic stream because there's something in
the blood that they want.
She also suggests - I don't know if this is true, I'm just quoting her
- that the desperate need to conduct rituals and drink human blood,
particularly blond-haired, blue-eyed blood, is because there's
something in there that they want, is actually part of their need to
hold this human three-dimensional form, through which they can
operate from the fourth dimension. And if they don't get this blood,
then they genetically start to fall-apart, in terms of the
three-dimensional, apparently, human form.
Whether that's true or whether it's not true, and obviously I don't
know that, when you look at totally unconnected sources who talk
about the involvement of the elite in these rituals, and stuff like
that, they say again and again, that some of the most famous people
in American politics, business, banking, and Britain too, like
Royal Family, are actually addicted to blood-drinking, and
particularly addicted to an adrenaline that enters the blood at the
point of sacrifice.
And it's like a theme, like I say, which you can follow back with
these bloodlines, right back to the ancient world. And when I talk
to therapists around the world who work with satanically abused
people, those who survived, trying to give them their minds back,
they tell me that the deities their clients tell them are used in
these rituals today are exactly the same deities that the Babylonians were using and the
using and the Phoenicians were using, right back in
the ancient world.
So, The Biggest Secret for me, in summary, is that an
extraterrestrial race has interbred with humanity, creating
particular hybrid bloodlines which they can work through from this
dimension very close to ours, and that as it expanded over the
thousands and hundreds of years to the present day, they've managed
to expand their power out of a power base in the Near and
Middle East, other places too but particularly there, until
today they are actually in control of the planet.
And it is the ultimate control because they're controlling the planet
from another dimension, but most of humanity doesn't even think that
there are other dimensions. And this suppression of knowledge about
other dimensions, the suppression of knowledge of the nature of
life, the nature of frequencies and vibrations, and the eternal
nature of consciousness, for reasons that this Illuminati
has created religions to suppress - indeed, make so off - limits for
many thousands of years just talking about these things is to
suppress the very knowledge or even perception that there could be
any other dimension or any other levels of life, which means that
they can go on controlling humanity from levels of existence that
most of humanity doesn't even accept exist. I mean, you can't get
better forms of control than that.
Martin: Ok. A couple of questions come to mind from what you've
just said. One, which is not a question that I would particularly
ask, but I'm sure other readers might: Have you encountered any
credibility issues since you have gotten into the reptilian subject?
And then, after you cover that: Obviously there is a Divine Hand
overseeing the entire planetary transition. What would you say to
those readers who despair over the apparent hopelessness at the
hands of these elite controllers?
Icke: Right, well, yeah, that's a big question. First of all,
let's answer the credibility thing. Let's make very clear where I'm
coming from. First of all, I really do not give a shit what anyone
thinks of me and what I do. What I care passionately about is trying
to uncover what's going on so that it can be stopped and changed,
and I care passionately about everyone having the right to hear all
information and not just that which will lead us to a certain
limited conclusion. I am completely emotionally detached from how
people receive what I do, because if I wasn't, you'd just go crazy.
People have a right to believe whatever they want to believe, and that
includes the right to dismiss whatever I say. I don't have a problem
with that. I have a problem with the suppression of the
communication of information. So, how people receive it is
completely up to them, and it's their absolute right to accept it,
accept a bit of it, or just dismiss the lot. That's up to them. So,
I don't have a problem with that, it's of no importance to me how
people receive it. It's important to me that they have the right to
have access to it.
On the other side of it, however, I would say this: I've spoken all
around the world about this, and The Biggest Secret has now
been out for a few months. I mean, you know, we're now into 30,000
print-runs on this book. I mean, it's extraordinary, the interest in
it. And, what has staggered me is that I've actually stood up on
public stages all over the world and talked about this, and the
reaction, while it has been one of astonishment to start with, it
actually makes sense to incredible numbers of people when they sit
long enough to hear the evidence. Because I'm not standing up there
and asserting this is what's going on, that's what's going on. I'm
saying this is the information, this is what people are
experiencing, look at the support of it in the ancient world. There
is a case to answer here, something is going on.
So, the way it has been received has been staggering. What I find
disappointing - it doesn't really matter to me, but I find
disappointing because of it's effect - is the way that some
conspiracy researchers, who are always saying that there's
suppressed information and all this stuff, actually want to suppress
the information I'm presenting that they don't like as well.
David Icke: It's extraordinary. I mean, people talk about
freedom, Rick, and yet they don't understand what it is. So often,
when I talk to people about freedom and they say, "Yeah want
freedom." If you talk to them long enough, you find that they don't
actually want freedom.
They want the freedom to replace an imposition they don't like with
an imposition they do!
You know, this is when you get the
Christian Patriot Movement,
of which I have great sympathy in the way that they are trying to
expose some levels of the conspiracy, but you know, I don't see much
of a difference between an imposed culture and imposed thought
through the Illuminati being replaced by an imposed thought through
"one nation under God". Because when you say, "Well, whose God are
we talking about here?" Theirs, of course, is the
version of God. That's no more freedom than anything else.
So, I find it sad that, even though "divide and rule" is actually
the foundation of all control by the few of the many, throughout
human history, without it you couldn't do it, that conspiracy
researchers and people in some of the religions still fall for this
scam of divide and rule.
So, actually, some of the most fierce abuse that I've had since the
book came out has not been from the public, actually, it's been from
some other conspiracy researchers who can't get their head around
anything beyond the physical. You know, be my guest. But surely
whether we agree with each other or not, what a boring world if we
did agree with everything we all said. Surely if we're going to get
to the heart of this, we need to focus on what we're all agreed on,
which is the need to expose that this world is controlled.
Now, I might have a certain view, based on the information that I've
uncovered, of who is controlling it and all that stuff, but let's
say, "Well, I don't agree with you on that, I can't get my head
around that, I haven't done that research anyway, so I don't know."
But let's agree on what we agree on, and let's go together, united,
behind the desire for freedom in the world. But instead of that,
once somebody writes anything or says anything that's different, to
even the conspiracy norm, because that norm has now started to
emerge, another bloody prison, then other conspiracy researchers
start laying-into and abusing each other. I mean, some of the stuff
that goes around on the Internet with conspiracy people abusing each
other, I mean, I reach for the sick-bag. I mean, the statement that
"a few can't control the world" is a piece of cake to knock down.
But the third point that you make is a very, very important one
because this is a whole area of research and understanding which I'm
now moving deeper and deeper into. We are multi-dimensional
beings. We have part of our consciousness working directly
through the physical form, in three-dimensional embodiment, in
three-dimensional awareness, but we exist on all other dimensions.
In the end, we are everything. You know, everyone is the same energy
consciousness, we are everything in the end.
There's only an "I", not even a "we", when you get to the highest
level of all this. But, I've actually talked about this in bits and
pieces in previous books, but I'm beginning to understand this more
and more, now.
I suggested in And The Truth Shall Set You Free that we could
well be living inside a vibrational prison, that somehow a
vibrational net had been thrown around this third dimension which
made it very, very difficult for three-dimensional embodied
consciousness - if you like, the consciousness that's looking
through the eyes and hearing through the ears - to connect with its
And it seems to me that this lower fourth-dimensional level, that this
elite-controllers group works on, and I want to emphasize this,
Rick, very, very strongly - when I talk about reptilians, I am not
talking about all reptilians. Just as when we talk about the Illuminati, we're not talking about people in physical form.
I'm talking about a particular group. I'm sure the reptilian form is
a massive constant across great chunks of this galaxy and beyond,
and I'm certainly not saying that anyone in reptilian form - any
time anyone sees anyone in reptilian form, and there are a lot of
people who do - and say, "I didn't get bad vibes from them."
Quite right, because we're not talking about ALL reptilians, we're
talking a group that appears to take a reptilian form because that's
how people keep seeing these people in power.
So, I would emphasize that very strongly because we don't want to get
into this "good guys/bad guys" crap or we lose the plot
again. The truth is never black or white; it's always a shade a
gray, it seems to me.
What I'm beginning to more and more understand is that this lower
fourth-dimensional level that this group operates from, this
"Illuminati consciousness" - we'll put it like that - is
the frequency range that vibrates to the emotions of fear and the
off-shoots of fear, like guilt, resentment, aggression, all these
things. And, therefore, the more that events can be created on the
Earth which generate - my goodness me, they do by the minute - the
emotions of fear, guilt, resentment, etc., within the human form, we are actually turned into generators of energy for that lower
fourth-dimensional frequency range, if you follow me.
Because every time we feel emotion, the emotion of fear, our
thought-emotional patterns are resonating energy around us and
within us to that frequency of fear, which appears to relate very
strongly to this lower fourth-dimensional level.
Now, where experiments have been done - I think the
in America has done a lot of this; it's got an Internet site, it's
very interesting - they've done experiments measuring the frequency
of various emotions, and they've shown that the frequency of fear is
very low, slow. And when we're feeling fear, it is actually
resonating our energy very slowly. When we feel the emotion of what
we call love, in it's truest sense, that is a very fast frequency
which actually resonates our energy very quickly. It's like waves
going through and resonating the energy, which is just neutral. I
mean, thought resonates the energy. Do you want it fast? Do you want
it slow? What were you thinking? What were you feeling?
So the more - this is vital to understanding this on a higher level, I
would suggest - the more that humanity lives it's life in fear and
the off-shoot emotions that come from fear, the slower the
vibrational resonance of consciousness working directly through the
physical form. If the highest expression of ourselves, beyond this
lower fourth-dimensional "cess-pit" vibration, as I call it, is
operating at a higher wavelength than fear, and ultimately at the
wavelength of love, what I would suggest is the highest wavelength
of all - just like Radio America cannot sync with
because they are on different wavelengths - the wavelength of fear
cannot sync with the higher wavelengths of love and other states of
So, in essence, as long as humanity can - in physical embodiment, that
level of our consciousness - be kept and immersed in the emotion of
fear, we actually vibrationally disconnect and can do nothing else,
can do nothing other than disconnect from the highest expressions of
who we are. We can't do anything other than that.
So, coming to the question, Rick, and it's a very important one, "How
do we get out of here?" and "Where are the good guys?"- I keep
hearing, "Where are the people coming to help us?"
Well, those of an emotional-mental state of being that wish to set -
not in embodiment, I mean other - dimensional beings who are of an
intent to set the planet free, they are of a level of vibrational
resonance, as a result of that state of being, in which they cannot
connect with consciousness that is in a state of fear. It simply
cannot happen because there is a vibrational gap between the
two. This is the vital point I would suggest, anyway.
It's not that those of higher-dimensional consciousness who wish to
set us free have to connect with us; it's that we, in fear, have
need to connect with them. And the only way of doing that is through
breaking out of fear; it's breaking out of the three-dimensional
illusion, the movie screen, the holographic kind of virtual reality
game that we're looking at when we open our eyes, and getting into
the wavelength of love, in it's true sense.
Because when we start to vibrate as a result of that state of being,
to the energy of love, and our intent is freedom for all, not just
ourselves, freedom in its true sense - freedom for you to say what I
don't agree with, freedom for you to live your life-style in a way
that I wouldn't live mine - that level of true freedom, that I will
stand for your freedom to say something that I disagree with as much
as I'll stand for mine to say what I think - when you hit that
level, then your state of being starts to vibrate faster and faster,
and starts to reach through this vibrational prison of
low-vibrational emotion, fear overwhelmingly, and reconnect with the
higher dimensions of ourselves; we start to become whole again.
Then we become lights or beacons that can bring this
higher-dimensional knowledge/consciousness/understanding into
embodiment and start to become like broadcast transmitters of it,
which starts to resonate and change the energy field that we're
living in, and starts to break-up this fear-based energy field that
we've been living in all this time-and have been manipulated to add
to every time we think and feel fear.
So, again, it's about responsibility BY ME. It's not about
saying, "Come and save us!" It's about saying, "How do we connect
with those who can guide us out of this abyss?"
What if this abyss is actually a lower vibrational energy field caused
by the overwhelmingly dominating fear emotion on planet Earth. We
have actually feared ourselves into a low vibrational state, which
has put us into a vibrational prison controlled from this lower
fourth dimension, which is expert at manipulating fear because that
is the vibration of it's being.
And if we could just turn that around and start resonating - by our
own actions and our own thoughts and our own state of being - to the
emotion of love, which is not "I love you darling because I saw you
in the disco." Love is the ultimate power because it will speak it's
truth and walk it's talk and do what it believes to be right, no
matter what the consequences to itself. That's the kind of love I'm
Because love has no fear - the emotion that actually takes our
power away - so love without fear must be the ultimate
If we can get into that state, we start to reconnect with those
levels. So we say, "Where are they?" Well, they're sitting around
waiting for us to connect with them, but WE have to make the
connection. Otherwise these other higher dimensions, that are
seeking to help us and of which we are a part, would have to come
into the wavelength of fear to connect with us-which would actually
defeat the object of the whole thing.
Martin: You continually use the term "problem, reaction,
solution". For those readers who are not aware what that is, would
David Icke: It's the most powerful mass-manipulation
technique that has been used over thousands of years to advance
this agenda to central, globalized control of all institutions of
our lives. Kosovo, Bosnia, all of these different manipulated wars
and problems - the Oklahoma City bombing, people going crazy with
guns around the world, in schools and stuff, these are classic
expressions of this.
If you want to introduce something like gun control, I think on gun
control we got manipulated into the wrong debate. Whether guns are
good, or whether guns are bad is actually a debate worth having, but
it's not the crucial debate at this moment because what's happened
by pulling us into this debate of "are guns good or are guns bad?"
is that it has actually diverted people from the debate which we
should actually be having in light of these events-which is why we
have this pattern all over the world.
Because I travel a lot, I tell you, it's happening everywhere, people
going crazy with guns, shooting people in the streets or schools,
and then immediately legislation being proposed to take guns out of
circulation. People should remember that gun laws were introduced in
Germany just before Hitler started filling concentration
I don't have guns. I wouldn't use guns. I'm not into guns. I don't see
the point in meeting violence with violence because you get twice
the violence. But we need to get street wise. Some people would use
guns, and on the face of it, it will be easier to take over an
unarmed population than an armed population, on the face of it.
That's not actually true, but on the face of it that appears to be
true. And, therefore, what better than taking guns out of
circulation before you've had your final coup, if you like. So,
"problem, reaction, solution" overcomes the situation in
which, if you introduced what you want to introduce, openly, then
you know that it would be so unpopular that you would get tremendous
resistance to it.
For instance, if you wanted to give more power to the police, more
power to the military, more power to stop and search, more power to
go into your homes without permission, etc., and you did that openly
without any of this other incentive-manipulation, there'd be
tremendous resistance from people who say, "This is a global,
fascist state!" or "This is a fascist country! You mustn't do this;
we're not having it!"
So "problem, reaction, solution" overcomes this. It's a brilliant
technique, very simple, and it means that not only do you avoid such
opposition, you actually manipulate people who would normally oppose
what you want, to see it as the only solution to the problems that
have been created and demand you introduce it.
So, in Stage One, you create a problem. You make sure, however,
someone else is blamed for it - a Timothy McVeigh, a Lee
Harvey Oswald, President Milosevic, and all this stuff - you create a problem.
You could create a war, as in Bosnia or Kosovo, you could create a
"terrorist" bombing, a government collapse, an economic collapse, or
whatever, a run on Wall Street, anything.
You then get your problem, which you've covertly created, to be
reported through your media in the way you want the people to
So, you report the Oklahoma City bombing as if it was due to a couple
of guys in a barn somewhere who produced this fuel-fertilizer device
which, of course, independent bomb experts have said couldn't
possibly have caused that damage in the building.
You then glean, as a result of this, the demand that "something must
be done!" "What are they going to do about it?" "We can't have this;
And so you've now had Stage One - create the problem.
And you've also, at this point, had Stage Two - the public reaction:
That allows you to play out the sting operation, called Stage Three,
which is offering the "solutions" you wanted to impose in the first
place, to the problems you have yourself created.
So, if you take the Oklahoma City bombing for instance, within 24
hours of the event at the James P. Murrah federal building on April
19, 1995, you had Bill Clinton calling for an easing of
restrictions on the military's involvement in domestic law
The Anti-Terrorism Bill, that went through Congress on the nod and
took away basic freedoms in America, went through purely and totally
because of the Oklahoma City bombing and as a reaction-solution to
The more deeply you look into these events which are blamed on other
people, the more clear it becomes that the people who proposed the
legislation, afterwards, are the people who created the problem in
the first place. And this is going on all the time.
We've just seen a massive example of this. I've been writing in my
books, and many other people have been too, that NATO
is designed to become the world police force, in some form, maybe
not even called NATO when it reaches that point, but certainly
NATO is the vehicle through which the global police force is
In Bosnia, the First Stage of this, you had the
UN peacekeeping operation as the status quo at the start of it. But that was
massively exposed, on purpose, in a coordinated way as being next to
useless. At the same time, horrific pictures were pouring through
our television screens night after night, of horrors in Bosnia.
This, of course, led to calls-as a result of this problem "something
must be done!"
And the solution was a 60,000-strong world army, under NATO control,
that took over in Bosnia. And, as I've shown in my books and talks,
every major peace negotiator appointed by the UN or
the European Union
to end the war in Bosnia - but no, they didn't, of course - was a
member of the
Bilderberg Group, the
Commission, and the
Council on Foreign Relations, sometimes all three.
Then, as a result of Bosnia, the status quo was changed from
reacting to these events with a UN peacekeeping
operation, to reacting to them with NATO. So when they
play Stage Two of this game, and that's all it is, this is not the
end of it, Kosovo - there was no talk of UN peacekeeping operations
- straight away, the status quo was NATO
reacting to Kosovo. And if people only looked at it, it's just
a mirror of Bosnia because there were no pictures.
I'm not saying
Milosevic is a nice man, but I want to know
who's actually controlling him, and who's controlling the Kosovo
Liberation Army, etc., and all these various groups in this
conflict. And I'm absolutely in no doubt that if you did the
research, you'd find that the people who control NATO
are the same people controlling Milosevic,
the same people controlling the Kosovo Liberation Army, etc.,
because you need to control different sides in a game to insure
certainty that the outcome is the one that you want it to be.
It was interesting that one of Milosevic's advisors during the Bosnian
conflict was one of the key advisers, a few years earlier, to Margaret Thatcher - just a coincidence, nothing to worry
So we have these horrendous pictures coming out of Kosovo of these
refugees pouring across the border and people forget that those
pictures only started after the NATO bombing. And the NATO bombing actually massively, massively expanded the
problem while claiming to be the solution. And what you have now, of
course, is what they wanted all along, which is ground troops in
Kosovo, and now they've got control of Kosovo and that whole area.
We're going to see Stage Two. I would say to people: watch the Chinese
hierarchy very carefully because people who I trust, indeed, people
who have been working on the inside for many years, tell me again
and again, there's a China card waiting to be played as part of the
process of creating a conflict big enough to turn, in one conflict,
NATO into a world army to stop any more conflicts of this
When you have the millennium mentality building up of "Come on, we've
come to the end of a millennium. Look at the horrors of this
millennium; let's start again", you have a global mentality that is
very open to change, and there's nothing wrong with that except that
if you control the forces of communication to the global mass-mind,
you can control and manipulate what is perceived to be positive
change, when actually it is only change that relates to the agenda
that you want to introduce.
I actually wrote in The Biggest Secret
about keeping an
eye on China and the China card, and the next thing I know they've
bombed the Chinese Embassy. Not only that, I think it was
magazine, about three weeks ago or so, did a virtual whole
edition demonizing China as the new monster and danger to the world.
So I think we're going to see something like that unfold, and it
will all be part of this recurring daily technique which happens in
the local area, in the states, in the country, and in the world, of
creating problems and offering the solutions to the problems.
It is the key technique. If people would only get street-wise to this,
they would start to see presidential announcements and terrorist
bombs and wars in a very, very different light.
I would just end the answer by saying this: The key question to ask in
this situation, I would suggest, is: Who benefits? Who benefits from
this Oklahoma City bombing? Who benefits from the wars? And who
benefits from me believing the version of these events that I'm
being asked to accept? And, again and again, when you ask that
question of who benefits, the answer is, invariably, anyone who
wants to further central power.