BILL RYAN (BR): We
can begin. So, Jim Humble, itís wonderful to meet you again.
This time weíre in snowy southern Germany.
Just let me say this to the camera here: This is the 22nd of
January, 2010. Iím still getting used to saying 2010 because it
was 2009 a short while ago. We last metÖ when was it now? It was
at the conference in [unclear: possibly Sasbachwalden] which
was, I think it was about 14 months ago.
JIM HUMBLE (JH): Yes, yes. I remember.
BR: And as we say in English: Thereís a lot of water under the
bridge since then. What I would love to know is what have you
been doing and where have you been doing it since we last met?
Tell us and everyone else who will be watching this, which will
be an awful lot of people, what you have been up to since our
last interview, which I think was in November 2008.
JH: Yes, well I went home to Mexico. I was in Mexico for about a
month and I started getting sick. I got sicker and I got sickerÖ
and I got really sick. I took MMS and I just got worse.
I said, Okay, Iím going to the hospital to find out whatís
wrong. So I went to the hospital and the first thing they did in
the hospital is X-ray my lungs. I donít know why they knew to
X-ray my lungs because I wasnít coughing, I wasnít breathing
real hard; I was breathing a little bit harder than normal.
They showed me the X-ray and my lungs were almost completely
filled with mucus. I was really feeling bad and they put me in a
room with some oxygen and all of that kind of stuff.
My secretary came in and she gave me a dose of MMS every hour.
But I was smart by then because what I had done wrong was I had
taken too big doses. I was taking it too heavy and thatís what
was really making me worse, was too big doses. I started taking
one drop an hour. All night long, I took one drop an hour.
Well, that hospital was really surprised that I got well in a
couple of days. Of course, they let me go once I was well.
But the point is that I really didnít know what to do until I
saw my lungs almost filled with mucus, and right away I knew it
was pig fluÖ the Swine Flu... because thatís what the swine flu
does. It goes directly into your lungs. It fills your lungs with
mucus and thatís what kills you, basically.
BR: So this was when the outbreak was starting in Mexico at that
JH: No, it was before that.
BR: Before that?
JH: Before the outbreak. I got well in about two days and they
let me go from the hospital on the third day when I got okay.
My secretary got it. I treated her pretty much the same way and
she got over it, too.
But then about two weeks later is when the outbreak in Mexico
City hit with the Swine Flu. They were saying that there were
only 80 deaths and that sort of thing. But we had friends in
that hospital, that special hospital that was treating it, and
they said 2000 deaths.
BR: Two thousand?
JH: Two thousand. So I called up the Senate because everyone
wanted to do something about it. I happen to have a friend in
the Senate, one of the top guys in the Mexican Senate.
And he said: Jim, I know you can help with this, but the safest
thing for you to do would be to get out of the country right
He said: I probably can protect you, but Iím not sure I can.
Iím not telling you who this guy was, but heís one of the top
guys in the Mexican Senate.
I went to the airport, and while I was waiting for the plane to
come in, to get on the plane, some people came and said a city
nearby had a lot of the Swine Flu in it. They really wanted
somebody to help them. They came over to get me and I said,
Okay. So I cancelled my flight and went to see a doctor in town
because I didnít want to go over to that city by myself.
But the doctor said: Yes, yes, Iíll go with you. He says: Weíll
go in early in the morning.
So the next morning, I called the doctor and he wouldnít even
talk to me. His secretary says: He isn't going to talk to you.
You just might as well forget about calling him anymore.
I called him several times. [The secretary said]: Just forget
about calling him because he isnít going to talk to you.
That just gave me the clue that I needed to get out of the
country, so I went back to the airport and got the first plane
out the next day.
BR: Because it had changed overnight?
JH: Yeah. I went to South Africa. I had a friend in South Africa
that invited me to Durban to meet a doctor there. I went to
another country in Africa and I also traveled by bus so that I
couldnít be traced.
I had a friend there who introduced me to a Catholic priest. The
Catholic priest helped me get doing work at the local clinic. Of
course, the Catholics owned the clinicÖ and it was an herbal
In addition to the herbal clinic, they had projects in the
herbal clinic of testing nutrients. I was able to get in on one
of those projects so that I could start proving out MMS.
So we started treating people for HIV and we just kept getting
bigger and bigger. Of course, I was furnishing all of the MMS
for free. Then I hired a man to keep records.
BR: And the patients were improving? The HIV patients were
JH: The HIV patients were all improving. They were all gettingÖ
A lot of them were
HIV/AIDS patients. Most of them had AIDS.
Most of them were really sick when they came in.
They had things like breast cancer and regular cancer in other
places on their body. There were 50 different things that were
wrong with people. Each one of them listed it on their record.
Every one of those people that came in - we finally treated 700;
by the time I get back itíll probably be 1000 - they just all
were in pretty bad shape.
Every one of them that finished the protocol that we checked,
and we checked hundreds of them, every one that we checked was
In other words, if they did the protocol, they were completely
healthy again, they were completely back to normal. A lot of
them, the ones that had cancer and various bad stuff, went back
to the doctor and had the doctor check them out. All of their
bad stuff was gone.
BR: Is this a particular protocol that you developed for these
patients? Or is this a standard protocol?
JH: It was sort of an improvement of the standard protocol that
I was using. But the standard protocol is on my website. It
isnít in my book.
BR: Thatís JimHumble.biz.
JH: Yes, thatís right,
JH: I updated that protocol there to match what Iím doing in
Africa. I didnít change much. It was just changed a slight
amount. Now itís extremely simple: Just take three drops of
activated MMS every hour for eight hours a day for three weeks.
If you can do that, your HIV/AIDS will be gone. Not only that,
in three weeks youíll be completely back to health. Everybody
who had cancer, it was gone by the end of three weeks. All the
rest of the diseases, too.
BR: Let me repeat that back to you. This is quite important for
people to write down as theyíre watching this: Three drops of
activated MMS per hour for eight hours a day for three weeks.
BR: And youíre saying that simple protocol is likely to handle
some pretty serious conditions.
JH: Except for cancerÖ I stated it wrong about cancer. It
handles most everything, but anytime you have cancer of any kind
I always give you MMS2, too. So you have that same protocol
except I add MMS2 to that.
BR: Now, what is MMS2? For the people who saw the first video
just over a year ago, what is MMS2?
JH: MMS2 is this chemicalÖ when you put it in water it changes
hypochlorous acid. Hypochlorous acid is that acid that the
immune system has been using for hundreds of thousands of years
to kill all of the things that the immune system needs to kill.
There are a lot of things that the immune system kills all of
BR: Because it produces hypochlorous acid naturally?
JH: Thatís right. Hypochlorous acid is naturally produced in
your body, and a lot of people are deficient in hypochlorous
acid. The funny thing about it is, even though this has been
known for years, nobody ever thought of giving a person extra
It never occurred to them! Now, why do you recommend that never
happened? Because they should have. It should have occurred to
anybody: This guy is deficient in hypochlorous acid. Iím going
to give him a little bit more and see if his immune system works
a little bit better.
Nobody ever did that. Iím the first guy who has done it and, of
course, Iím not a doctor. But it would seem to me like it should
have occurred to any doctor to do it. It just seems like it
BR: What was the story behind this occurring to you to try that?
Because this was something you hadnít stumbled on when we last
JH: Yeah, well I stumbled on it because... I hate to say it, it
wasnít because I was smart. [laughs] I stumbled on it. I have a
friend that helped me with the chemistry a little bit.
JH: One day he says: You know, one day Iím going to try some of
Calcium hypochlorite. He says: Chlorine is good for the
system. Iíve tried a number of other chlorine things. Iím going
to try that. So we tried it for a few weeks.
Then he had some friend that had prostate cancer and we said:
Well, letís see if we can find somebody who is willing to try
it. So we gave it to him and, believe it or not, the prostate
cancer went away in a couple of weeks. He started feeling better
right away after taking it. In a couple of weeks they had a test
- no more prostate cancer.
BR: That was with the MMS2 on its own?
JH: That was the MMS2 on its own.
JH: I said to myself: Thereís got to be something about this
that I donít know yet. So I started studying it and found out
that when you put Calcium hypochlorite into water it changes to
hypochlorous acid. Well, guess what?
Calcium hypochlorite is pool chlorine. Most chemists donít
realize that pool chlorine is really hypochlorous acid. You put
Calcium hypochlorite into water and it changes into hypochlorous
JH: Thatís HOCl. When it goes out and kills various things in
the pool and sterilizes the pool it isnít chlorine thatís
killing those things, itís oxygen. The oxygen comes off that
The oxygenÖ the O that comes out of that goes and kills things.
It isnít the chlorine. The Cl becomes table salt.
JH: So, itís just something that most people donít understand,
and I didnít understand it either. But after we had been playing
with it and stumbled on it I finally found that out.
BR: So it was after that, you refined it further?
BR: So the protocol you were using in Africa was a combination
of MMS1 and MMS2? Is that right?
JH: Yes. When a person has cancer, I add that to their protocol.
Youíd be amazed at the fantastic results I got with cancer when
I added that to it.
But anyhow, to finish up the story in Africa, everybody was
getting well, everybody who did the protocol, the 700 people
that I treated... everybody who did that protocol, that we could
determine did the protocol, and most of them did.
When they saw their friends getting well, they figured theyíd
better do the same thing, and they did; they followed through.
We checked on those people. We went to their homes and checked
on them. We said: Show us what youíre doing. They were doing it
The ones that had done it right, and most of them had, they were
well, all the way up to feeling back to normal, back to their
jobs, back to teaching school or whatever the hell they were
doing. They were back to their lives. They had come to us sick
and now they were okay.
Now you say: How could we prove that they were well? There is no
way of proving those guys were well because all tests for HIV
test for antibodies. Antibodies are always going to be there
whether the HIV is there or not. The antibodies are going to be
there - or antigens
Some tests are just for the special proteins that they think are
in the virus. But no matter what it is, youíre never testing for
the virus. Youíre always testing for something that has to do
with the virus. Thereís no way of proving that a person is
BR: Okay, but youíre getting anecdotal evidence by listening to
people saying: Listen, I feel great. Yes?
JH: Yes, anecdotal, and thatís all we care about. As long as
those people are happy and theyíre healthy and theyíre back to
their lives, weíre happy.
BR: [laughs] Are you also getting reports from people outside of
Africa whoíve heard about these protocols and who are applying
it to themselves?
JH: Absolutely. Iíve got a lot of reports. I have 35,000 emails.
Now, every one of those emails arenít from people whoíve got
well, but some of them are. Either I or my secretary has
answered every one of those emails that come in, no matter what
they are. Whether theyíre questions or whether theyíre sick and
they need to know something or whatever, we answer them all.
In any case, we got lots of reports from outside of Africa and
around. But I was using mostly that protocol before I left
BR: The exact protocols for people now who really want to know
what to doÖ youíre saying that itís written up accurately on
your website, JimHumble.biz.
JH: Thatís right. And also there are a number of other protocols
on there, and the one for cancer is on there, too, that tells
you how to use MMS2 along with the MMS1.
BR: Is it easy to get hold of MMS2 Ö people who want to get hold
JH: You can get it anywhere in the world. Itís one of the most
available chemicals on Earth because no matter what country you
go to, I donít care how third-world a country it is and how poor
the people are there, there are always rich people there, too.
And those rich people, a lot of them have swimming pools.
This particular chemical is mostly for swimming pools although
itís used for everything else. Itís used for water purification,
JH: Around the world, itís one of the better chemicals for water
BR: But surely you want to be very careful about what youíre
getting? Because if you go to a hardware store and get a bottle
of stuff thatís for cleaning your swimming pool, it could
JH: Thatís right, you canít do that. Itís very important that
you use Calcium hypochlorite. Thereís such a thing as Sodium
hypochlorite. Itís used for the same thing, but you canít use
that for your MMS2.
Itís got to be Calcium hypochlorite, not Sodium hypochlorite.
The Sodium hypochlorite is cheaper and itís not as good.
BR: Does it work in the same way as MMS1, that you activate it
with an acid?
JH: No, you donít activate it.
BR: You just add it to water?
JH: No, you donít add it to water. You put it in a gel capsule.
JH: You fill the gel capsule up, then you take a few of those in
a dayís time. Thatís MMS2. It turns to hypochlorous acid in your
stomach when it hits the water. Weíve got fantastic results from
it. If you didnít have any MMS1, you could still use MMS2. It
will do everything that MMS1 will do.
We could use them both all the time, but thereís no point in it.
MMS1 does the job and we only need MMS2 for the cancer.
BR: Now, for people that havenít seen the first video, youíre
not making any money out of the sales of MMS, are you?
BR: So just to say this for you, and for you to verify, youíre
actually wanting to make this freely available to the world as a
grassroots remedy for these things that otherwise you could
spend thousands of dollars trying to fix and not even succeed.
BR: Your income comes from sales of your book.
JH: Thatís right. I donít make any income from the sale of MMS1
or 2. A lot of people around the world do, though. A lot of
people make a living from it. A lot of people are giving it
away. So itís pretty available in most places now.
BR: And thatís something that you encourage. You want people toÖ
JH: Absolutely! I tell them in my book how to make it, how to
manufacture it in your kitchen. A lot of people will call me up
and say that theyíre doing it and they want to know if they got
the mixture right.
I can ask them one question and if theyÖ I know for sure they
cannot fake it. I can make sure that they have the correct
mixture from right here [gestures to self] just by them telling
me what theyíre doing in their kitchen. If their answer is
right, I know it canít be faked, so then I know the mixture is
BR: Okay. So what is your book and how do people get that?
JH: My book is
Miracle Mineral Supplement of The
21st Century and
itís on miraclemineral.org.
BR: Thatís the book where the first part is available for free?
JH: Thatís right.
BR: And then what I would like to highly recommend, as would
you, is that then they pay the small amount extra for the second
half of the book that tells the entire story from the beginning,
JH: Thatís right. You can download the first half for free and
then the second half you can download for twelve bucks. Or you
can buy it in the hard copy and have it sent to you anywhere in
BR: And itís being translated into a large number of other
JH: Yes, there are eleven languages. The main language is
BR: Okay. Now, this sounds like an incredible story that so many
people watching this will want to know more about. What happens
next? Where do you go from here? How do you spread the word?
Whatís the future of this huge project that youíve started here?
JH: Well, in the country that Iím in in Africa, I want to
complete that whole country. We want go through the entire
country and handle most of the disease thatís there. The country
is 60 percent HIVÖ 60 percent HIV!
BR: Thatís almost impossible to imagine.
JH: It is, isnít it? And all of those peopleÖ well maybe not all
of them, but at least 50 percent of them are taking the ARV
drugs. [Ed note: antiretroviral drugs] Now, can you imagine how
many millions of dollars every year theyíre taking out of that
one country in ARV drugs?
I wish that anybody who thinks about ARV drugs, or thinks that
theyíre good, would just take and open up an ARV drug package
and look in it and see what it says.
It will tell you that itís killed dozens of people just in the
tests being made... in the tests to see what it does. The small
print that nobody reads! Itís killed dozens of people just in
And then thereís anotherÖ on the back of the sheet, thereís at
least 35, 40, 50 diseases that the ARV drugs have caused people
to have. They put it right in print and say it because the law
requires them to. Then they tell those poor African people that
if you donít take these drugs, youíre going to die.
Theyíre taking them while taking MMS and the drugs are being
neutralized. After they get done with the protocol theyíre still
taking the MMS two or three times a week. If they donít, theyíre
going to get sick again because of those drugs, and theyíre
scared to quit taking them because the doctor says: If you quit
taking these drugs, youíre going to die.
And those peopleÖ you knowÖ theyíre not educated. They donít
know. If the doctor says theyíre going to die, they believe
theyíre going to die.
BR: So this means that a big part of your mission is education.
JH: Yeah, but I canít educate those people. I canít do it
because if I start telling them that, theyíll throw me out of
the country so fast it isnít funny.
BR: How do you propose to spend the next year? Whatís your
vision for the next year, if everything goes well for yourself?
JH: The Catholics have already said Iíve got to start with my
own clinic. By the time Iím back there, my people should have
rented a clinic thatís close to the bus station so people can
get to it from all over that particular country. Theyíre coming
in to be treated for HIV right now at about 25 people a day. The
whole idea there is to get our whole system in.
Weíre not going fight the medical system thatís already in
there. Weíre not going to do anything against the medical
system. Weíre just going to put it in and have it alongside the
medical system, so they have a choice of either coming to us to
get well or going to the medical people to get well.
BR: So youíre not picking any fights with anybody?
JH: Thatís right.
BR: Thatís probably pretty smart.
JH: And, of course, thereís lots of malaria there, a tremendous
amount of malaria there. Of course, as you know, malaria kills
more people than anything else in the world.
We will also put a sign up on our clinic for malaria, too, you
know? Weíll be treating HIV and malaria and weíll slowly
increase that to other diseases that they might have. Thereís
sleeping sickness and various other different diseases that they
have in that area that they might get.
Pretty soon, people will be coming to us for everything.
BR: For the benefit of the people who are seeing this video for
the first time and havenít seen the previous one, malaria was a
success story that really got MMS well known in the world
because your first trials, didnít you cureÖ wasnít it 80,000?
JH: More like 100,000.
BR: One hundred thousand.
JH: Of course, it wasnít me. It was people I trained.
JH: I did treat more than 2000 malaria cases myself. But yes,
thatís one of the things that really got it known to some
people, of course.
BR: Thatís in a different group of African countries. Right?
JH: Yes. Yes, that was different groups. Anybody that came to me
and said theyíre going to Africa, Iíd give them as much as they
told me they could use.
One guy came and said he could use 500 bottles, so we got him
500 bottles. He took them in boxes over there. He treated
thousands of people over on the Ivory Coast, but he only was
there for a few months. He treated all of these people and he
went back to America, and so it didnít get continued.
BR: But the word is spreading throughout the world by word of
mouth. You donít see commercials for MMS on television. You
donít see it on billboards. And yet, itís all over the internet.
Itís all over the alternative community. There must be millions
of people by now whoíve benefited from this treatment.
JH: A couple of million at least.
BR: A couple of million?
BR: And a lot more that you might never get to hear about.
JH: Yes. One interesting point that I want to add in here,
because I like itÖ and that is: No matter how bad a condition
that anybody is in, once they have started taking MMS they donít
I donít care if theyíve got cancer and the doctor has given them
two weeks to live. If they start taking MMS, there has been no
report of any of these people dying. Thereís been no report
anywhere in the world that somebody died after they started on
MMS, regardless of what condition they were in.
And if there had been... Believe me, I get emails from all over
the world and I get reports on how itís going all over the
world. I wouldíve known about it within hours if somebody had
died. So far, nobody has died. People kept telling me:
Somebodyís going to die and then youíre going to be in trouble.
Well, that hasnít happened. In ten years, that hasnít happened.
Nobody has died.
It really does amazing things in the body right away. You take
it and thereís amazing things starting to happen in your body;
and the worse condition your body is in, the more amazing things
BR: What do you think is the message for other people, or maybe
the inspiration also for yourself in terms of taking this on?
Are there other opportunities for people to join you in this
mission, or in their in own missions, that have got to do with
body-healing in a different way?
JH: Oh, I think thereís a lot of people out there right now who
have their own missions. Theyíre out training people in their
neighborhoods, and neighborhoods in Africa.
Thereís a lot of different people carrying MMS to different
places in Africa and treating the people there. There is nobody
doing it in a huge scale, like thousands of them, but thereís a
lot of people doing it in small scales around.
Iíd like to think that MMS is bringing a message to the world.
That is: It worksÖ for one thingÖ but the message is that we
need the freedom to use what we need for own bodies.
I mean, no government should have the right to tell us that we
canít have a particular medicine or a particular solution or a
particular food or anything.
The governments... more and more are trying to control it more
and more. And there are new laws going in every day - big laws!
- tremendous laws that are trying to stop us from getting the
vitamins and the foods that we want to have ourselves.
I think that the main message that MMS should be bringing right
now is that we needÖ the people need, or the world needs their
freedom, that we should not allow the governments to take our
freedom away from us.
And thatís what we have been doing for the last 100 years; the
governments have been taking our freedoms away from us as fast
as they can.
That message should go to people that thereís something that you
can take. The governments would like to stop you if they get a
chance, but donít let them. [laughs]
BR: Itís not just about a practical solution which people can
use to optimize their health. Itís a matter of principle about
JH: Thatís right. Exactly. If we donít insist on that, weíre
going to wind up without the things that we need.
BR: Very good, Jim. Thank you. Youíre heading off back to Africa
in a few days time, is that right?
JH: Thatís right.
BR: And do you plan to stay in Africa? Or is the future so fluid
that you donít really know what you personally will be doing?
JH: Well, I plan to stay in Africa for a while, but Iím putting
together a school in the Dominican Republic, a training school
In the beginning itís going to be two weeks of intensive
training. A person goes there and we not only train them but we
have them actually do it for two weeks of actual application of
MMS for practically everything in the worldÖ and two weeks of
getting it applied to them.
By the time a person leaves there, theyíll know exactly what
they can do with MMS and what they canít do with it because they
will have done all of those things.
BR: So itís going to be like a little internship.
JH: Thatís right, an internship, and theyíll be treating one
another as well as treating the locals. It will pretty much give
them a good idea of what they can do when they get back to
wherever theyíre getting back to.
To tell you the basics of it - for $1000 they get two weeks.
They get room and board for two weeks and they get all of their
training. When they leave, they have six bottles of MMS and a
number of other things. So they really wind up with a bigger
value than the cost of the $1000 for staying there. And itís a
nice vacation, a hard-working vacation, but a nice vacation.
BR: Where can people find out about that?
JH: It will be on the internet. They should look on my site.
Itíll be on JimHumble.biz and it will be probably on my other
site. I have 20 sites. You can go to JimHumble.biz and then lead
off onto my other sites from there, but it will be on
JimHumble.biz when itís ready.
Itís being worked right now and it should be ready in a month or
two for actual people.
BR: If anyone wants to support you in any way - practically,
materially, financially - what should people do to communicate
with you personally?
JH: Well the best way for sending me moneyÖ the best way right
now is MMS1@JimHumble.com. Any money that comes in there, my
secretary will send them a receipt that they can use for tax
purposes because that money goes from there right into my
BR: Okay. Now, when you say MMS1@JimHumble.com, is that a PayPal
JH: Thatís a PayPal account.
BR: Okay, good.
JH: So it comes in that way.
BR: All right. There are opportunities for people to support you
in Africa if anyone wants to have an adventurous sabbatical, for
anyone who is appropriately qualified - maybe somebody who has
nursing experience, tropical medical experience, or who just
fancies hanging out for a while with a pioneer doing some
exciting work. Is this the kind of opportunity thatís available?
JH: Yeah, yeah. People could come, and especially if theyíre
interested in helping in some way, especially with money. We
will need more and more money as time goes on, but weíre doing
okay now. It shouldnít sound like we arenít. The time will come
Weíre spreading out really slow, but the whole idea is to put in
a separate organization that people can come to.
Iím never going to replace the medical system. We arenít going
to try and prove it and get it into the medical system. Weíre
never going to do that. I never want to prove it. I never want
to have the medical system as my enemy.
I just want to become a healing system, basically, that goes out
there throughout the various different countries and is
available for anybody who wants to get treated. Weíll treat them
our way or they can go over and get operated on the medical way
[laughs] Öeither way.
BR: Maybe you can say that you want to support people that are
aware of their own personal sovereignty.
JH: Yes, that too. [laughs]
BR: Okay, got it. Jim, itís been a great pleasure talking to
you. I would love to keep up our communication. Would you be
back here in Europe next year sometime?
JH: Probably soÖ yes.
BR: We should do interim updates on your progress and your
expansion of your mission.
JH: Yeah, that would be fun!
BR: Jim Humble, thank you so much. I look forward to catching up
with you again next year.
JH: Thank you, thank you. I look forward to seeing you next
BR: Wonderful. Jim Humble, the man and his wonderful
Now, Jim, I canít let you go without telling us about another
project that you were researching that goes back to your gold
mining days. You told me something about this off camera that
was so unbelievable that...
Itís an extraordinary story that I would love you to share. Itís
got nothing to do with MMS. Itís something to do with disposing
of radioactive waste. Tell us about this.
JH: We were working with recovering extra gold, precious metals,
from ores, and we learned to burn the ores at a high
Burning those ores at a high temperature, if there was any
radioactivity in certain materials, and materials that were
radioactive, we learned that we could reduce the radioactivity
to zero. So we started experimenting with different radioactive
An example was a radioactive material thatís in the oil pipes
that they use to transport oil in the southern states to
different places from the oil wells. Those pipes have to be
cleaned out every so often.
Theyíre radioactive. The material is radioactive in there. Itís
low radiation, but itís high enough that the government wonít
let you throw it away, and they wonít let you keep it. So if you
canít keep it and you canít throw it away, you sort of wind up
with piles here and there. Itís illegal, but thereís nothing you
can do with it.
So we got some of that material and were able to reduce the
radiation to zero by burning it. In the process of burning, it
created enough precious metals in there to more than pay for the
process. In fact, you can make about $1000 per ton above the
cost of burning the material.
The burning material... For example, itís material that we add
to it, a material about like gun powder. With the gun powder and
the proper chemicals added to that, the radiation always dropped
It takes three days after you burn it for the radiation to go
all the way to zero. We had very good Geiger counters and that
sort of thing.
Weíve demonstrated the process to Texas A&M and other
universities. Three or four other universities finally sent
professors to look it over and see if we were lying or what.
[laughs] We always demonstrated it. We always showed it worked,
and nobody ever believed it.
BR: I canít tell you how bizarre this sounds. This is
impossible, what youíre talking about.
JH: Thatís trueÖ or it sounds impossible.
BR: It sounds impossible.
JH: Yes, but I have to say that thereís a lot of things that are
ďimpossibleĒ that get done all the time. You can take a chicken
and put it in a place where it canít possibly get any calcium
and itíll still produce eggs.
BR: Yes, thatís right. There seems to be a biological capacity
for transmutating elements.
JH: Thatís right.
BR: I know that in mainstream biology that is regarded as
ďwitchcraft thinkingĒ, but there is some evidence for this.
Youíre saying that thereís some kind of chemical transmutation
of elements that is taking place when you burn this radioactive
waste in a particular way. Is that right?
JH: Yes, we produce a particular kind of gunpowder that produces
a really, really high temperature. Burns slowÖ it doesnít go
bang! It goes slow, but it produces such a high temperature that
you really donít want to look at it because itíll hurt your
It produces a really, really high temperature, and then you just
let it sit there until it cools. And you grind it up and you get
a certain amount of precious metals out it.
And, like I say, the radioactivity always goes to background
level - nothing left. Itís always gone, completely.
BR: In three days?
JH: In three days.
BR: That is bizarre! [laughs] I canít tell you how bizarre this
is. If anyone here doesnít have a physics or a chemistry
background, this is really bizarre. [both laugh]
Thatís an incredible story. But of course thereís a message to
this, isnít there, which is youíve got to be prepared to examine
the unbelievable in order to make a breakthrough in any kind of
science or technology.
JH: Thatís right. You bet!
BR: And one of the messages here is that mainstream academic
processes donít allow one to do that because youíve got to work
within the system.
JH: Anybody who wants the formula, Iíd be glad to tell them how
to do it, with the one idea that if they actually make a
business from it or use it somewhere, I get part of the profits.
BR: So this is another thing that people can contact you about.
Thatís an amazing story!
JH: Yeah, they can contact me if theyíre really interested and
they have money or something that they want to do with it. Just
for casual interestÖ I donít see any point in discussing it
BR: Well, you want to be careful about this because youíre going
to get a lot of messages from people when they hear this.
Listen, Iíve got one last question before we close: What
happened to that hat? You had a beautiful hat which I met you in
14 months ago.
JH: Actually, it was just about as good as the one youíve got!
[laughs] I loved that hat. I always liked wearing that hat. The
problem with it is I keep thinking about the idea that if those
bad guys are going to come for me, theyíre going to say: Just go
down the street and shoot the guy with the hat. [both laugh]
I figure Iím not going to give them that much satisfaction.
Theyíll probably give me another ten seconds or fifteen seconds
to get away if I donít have the hat on. [laughs]
BR: You think I should be taking this advice onboard?
JH: I think you shouldÖ because youíre one of the guys theyíre
going to be mad at! [laughs]
BR: I donít know. I havenít got quite as much hair as youíve
got, actually. Youíve got some beautiful silvery locks there
that make you look pretty handsome. I hide my bald patch
JH: Well, youíll just have to worry about that later, I guess.
BR: [laughs] Okay. Jim, thank you so much.
JH: Youíre welcome. Thank you.