Start of interview
Kerry Cassidy: I'm Kerry Cassidy
from Project Camelot, and we're here introducing Dan Sherman.
He's a very, very, fascinating guy, and we are very interested
and excited to be able to interview him here today.
He's a little bit hard to catch - he's not been doing interviews
lately, and I think he keeps a very low profile. I don't know if
that's intentional or if that's just the way the cards fall.
Dan, maybe you could give us a short overview of just who you
are, and what an amazing story you have to tell.
Dan Sherman: Sure. I went into the military, just like any 18
year-old, right out of high school. I was in a certain job - a
security police job, and at some point I was kind of led to
another job, which was electronic intelligence.
This job provided me access to a higher security classification,
and so I got top-secret clearances and SCI clearances. That led
me into a world where the... well, to back up, the military kind
of had a plan for me, as it was revealed later on, but at this
point I didn't know that was going on.
But evidently, it was after I had gone into this other
electronic intelligence field that I went to a school to get
trained for it. I was called into an office, the Captain's
office; he was in charge of the school, I believe it was. I went
into his office, and he revealed this amazing story to me.
Evidently I - at birth, or actually in the womb - I was
genetically managed to have a particular ability, and this
ability was what he called 'intuitive communications'. How this
happened was - and this is where a lot of people rolls their
eyes, and I rolled my eyes at the time - and I was like, “I
can't believe this is happening to me.”
But he said that my mother was abducted when she was pregnant
with me. The fetus - which was me - was genetically managed. He
said everybody had this particular ability that I was
genetically managed for, but mine was just heightened to an nth
I was at the school to not only learn a certain particular
procedure for my job, my regular job, electronic intelligence,
but I was also there to go to another school, which was to
uncover this ability that I have. I had the ability, but it was
like I wasn't able to control it or to know it was there until
it was uncovered to me so I could practice at it, so to speak.
So he told me where to meet the van and told me all the
logistics of how it would operate and I started going to a
school that would allow me to uncover this ability and to
That was at nighttime - in the daytime, I was going
to my regular schooling for the job that I was doing -
K: How old were you at this time?
D: I have to have a caveat here, because one of the things that
I can't reveal in the book has to do with locations, because
this is how they hide this type of thing.
You are assigned to a 'black' assignment, which is legitimately
classified for a reason - because of national security, etc.
They do that so they can keep the gray related projects attached
to black related projects, so that they would have a reason to
have heightened security at that location.
Therefore, they assign people who are a part of gray projects to
these black projects. There's a reason to get them to that
location, and there's a reason for them to be there, and it's
all under the guise of the black project and the funding of the
black project, etc.
So my complication in writing the book is that I don't want to
reveal national security issues, because that's legitimate. I
mean I don't want our country being crippled by my big mouth.
But by the same token, I do want to reveal the gray projects,
which have nothing to do with national security and have
everything to do with power to the government.
So I have to be very careful as to what I release, as far as the
gray project goes; how it relates to the black projects that I
worked on. One of those is the location that I was at, at a
particular time and at a particular age. I don't want to
correlate these things.
K: I see. Okay.
D: I'm not trying to evade the issue. I mean it is kind of a
simple question: “What year were you doing that?”
Anybody can look at my military record and see when I went to
school at the NSA. I mean they can see the trail, so to speak. I
can list all the bases I've been to; but when I start talking
about black projects related to the gray projects, I can't say
that in the same sentence as the base that I have been at.
K: Okay. Why don't we list the bases you were at, and get those
out of the way? That way you won't have to refer to any specific
D: Sure. I've been at Osan Air Base in Korea; I've been there
I've been to Offutt Air force Base in Nebraska, which is the SAC
Headquarters. I'm not sure if it's called SAC anymore, Strategic
San Vito Dei Normanni - actually, it's called 'San Vito' - in
Italy, in the southern tip of Italy, and I've been to Buckley
International Guard Base, I was stationed there in Denver,
K: And have you mentioned Germany yet?
D: No, I haven't been stationed in Germany.
K: You haven't.
D: No. I've done temporary duty there. I've gone to school there
and I was deployed there, but never have been stationed in
K: I see.
D: I was stationed in Holland though, and thank you for bringing
me to the European theatre. I was stationed in Holland for a
couple of years. It was my absolute favorite base; I loved it.
K: Are we allowed to ask how many years you spent in the
D: Yeah. I was there for twelve years. I went in 1982 when I was
eighteen, and I got out in 1995. I spent twelve years there.
K: Tell me how you want me to put this... as an alien
communicator, an ET communicator?
D: Well, they called it 'intuitive communication'.
K: Are you an empath as well?
D: No. I don't think I am in the strict term; however, I can
really, really sense people's emotions, probably more than your
average person - but I wouldn't go so far as to say that I'm an
empath because it's not like overbearing or overpowering. I'm
just really sensitive to people's moods and emotions.
But, back to this ability... this is an ability that it is
really, really concrete. I mean, it's like we are talking right
now; you say something, and it conveys a message and it is a
pretty solid message. If I need to clarify that message or ask
you to clarify it, I can ask you to clarify it, but it's a very,
very concrete communication that we are doing when we're
talking, and that's the same way with the intuitive
There's no room for error. You know, you hear about these people
who have the ability to, what's that called, the remote viewers,
they get these senses and these images. It's not real concrete;
it's not like looking at a picture. There's room for
interpretation, but that's not like this. Intuitive
communication is extremely concrete. The communications are
K: Okay, that's great to hear. So, are you saying that you hear
a voice in your head?
D: No. No. It's not a voice.
K: Okay, do you see pictures?
D: It's not vocal and it's not image based as if when you send -
here's a good analogy - when you send somebody a jpeg image
through e-mail; the e-mail itself, the transmission of that
information, is in bits through electronic means.
And then at the other end, the computer compiles that
information, that electronic information, and then displays an
image to you.
When we think of e-mail, we just think we got a picture. But
actually, we got all kinds of electronic bits and the computer
put it in the form of a picture for you.
So that's the same way with intuitive communications. The medium
itself was not a visual medium, but when it got to me and my
brain assessed that information, it put it into a picture for me
so that I could understand or my mind could convey - because I
had to convey all these communications through a computer to
some place... I have no idea where it went.
But when I got a communication, I had to convey this
communication. So a lot of it was rendered in pictures in my
head; but sometimes it was just rendered in language, the
English language, and sometimes it was rendered in smells even,
sometimes. I could sense a smell.
K: You're getting a whole picture, not just snippets?
D: No, it's a full mode of communications. I can sense things
around the communications, but it was a direct, it's kind of
hard to put it in terms, but you know when we're sitting here in
this interview room, when I'm talking to you and I'm looking at
you, I know that there's a picture there and there's, you know,
like a television here and there, so I understand that that
stuff is there.
But our communication is what is taking up the focus of my
attention, and that was the same way with the intuitive
communications - I could sense emotions from my contact and I
could sense a peripheral - it wasn't like here, 'cause there are
a lot of things to sense here, but...
K: You went in to meet with this man, and he basically told you
about your mother and what you were trained for. Is that right?
D: Yes. Well, what I was going to be training for. Yeah, he told
me about my mother being abducted and he told me a little bit
about the project. I don't think he knew a lot about the
project, I think he was just doing his job too, which was to be
my contact and my handler, so to speak.
K: And how did that make you feel when you found this out?
D: You know it's funny when you look back on it now, because I
was such a different person then. Obviously, I was very young -
and when you're young you look at things a lot differently than
when you are older and experienced.
In retrospect, if I were to been have told that today, I
wouldn't have been so naive as to just accept it; because today,
I'm forty-some years old and you don't accept things at face
value the way you do when you're younger and you have no
inhibitions. You're like, “Yeah, okay, let's do this!”
There was some sort of skepticism, because I knew that in the
military a lot of times you get joked on or 'punked', or
whatever you want to call it... you know, initiations and stuff.
I knew that I was coming to a school and there was a small worry
there that it was a joke and someone was going to jump out of
the closet and say, “Ha-ha, you believe this alien thing!” Of
course, that didn't happen.
But, for the most part, it was the military; it was the military
in me. I said, “Okay, well, this is a mission and I've got to
accept this as just another reality in my life, and I've got to
move on and do what I'm told.” But it was shocking.
K: It was shocking.
D: It was very shocking.
K: Okay, because I was just wondering, did you have experiences
in your childhood that might have prepared you for that moment,
such that you might have accepted it a little quicker, a little
easier? You were almost created to do a certain mission. So it
was within your programming, to use that term very loosely, to
be prepared for that notion. Did you have any conscious memories
of your own ET experiences?
D: I only did that in retrospect later on as I thought about it.
Of course, it didn't occur to me at that particular moment when
he told me.
Just to clarify also, my mother got pregnant in a very normal
way so that the creation itself was there normally, but it was
one of the questions I had. “Am I human? Am I 100% human?”
And he said, “Yes, you're definitely 100% human. It's just that
your genetic make-up was tweaked a little bit to allow for this
K: And do you have a Celtic background, like many people of that
nature or... you know what I'm saying?
D: You mean for my genealogy?
D: We're from Europe - northern Europe - England and France, and
I have a little bit of Cherokee in me, too.
K: I was going to ask you if you have some Indian. Okay, so
there you go. Did you ever talk to your mother about this?
D: Yes. Yes, I have talked to my mother. I didn't talk to her
until about four years after the book came out because I just
felt that bringing it up to my mom really wouldn't add anything
to the scenario and it just might, depending on her reaction,
have been detrimental to our relationship.
So, I had to weight the pros and cons of actually talking to her
about it. If she did have memories of something and she did
accept and support my coming out with what I did come out with -
my story - then it really doesn't add anything to the story
because the story is the story. I mean my experience is the
experience, and there is nothing that's going to take away from
that, because it happened.
But her saying that something happened would have been nice and
it would have been a little bit of an addendum to my experience.
But if she didn't have any memories and she didn't accept it -
because it is a hard thing to understand and to believe for a
lot of people - I didn't want to risk our relationship
deteriorating because of my experience.
It was a difficult decision, but I finally took her out one day
and I told her that I had written a book and she was like,
Now my mother is not exactly a world traveler you know, she
lives in her own little world and that's it. So I wasn't too
concerned about her running across the book anywhere.
So I told her and she said she didn't have any memories of any
abductions or anything but she has had some unique experiences.
She actually saw a UFO one time. I remember it because she was
screaming and hollering in the bedroom, and I came, and she saw
it out the window, so I remember that.
She has had some unique experiences, but she fully accepts it;
she says she knows the person I am, and that I'm not going to be
saying stuff like that if it's not something that actually
happened. So she's fine with it, but she doesn't have any
memories, so there is no correlation there, so to speak.
K: Okay. So you were told that you were brought in and actually
given sort of a deeper clearance in order to do this new
D: Well, the clearances were the same because at this particular
base where I was going to school there was no cover, the black
cover, so to speak. They always make you sign these papers
saying you're not going to discuss this, that and the other
As it applies to the gray projects I worked on, it's kind of a
moot point because there is no paper trail, there's no proof
that anybody could bring out of a facility that proves what you
are doing with the gray projects.
K: So, this is purposeful on the part of the military obviously,
if there is no paper trail. This is what they want.
D: Yeah, and that's how they hide it so well. Because when you
work on - in the early eighties, I worked on the F117 Stealth
thing in Dreamland, so to speak, in Nevada.
You know, you could slip in a camera and take a picture of
something; it's feasible. So, there's actual proof that you can
gather. Now you probably wouldn't want to, because of the
trouble you'd get in, but there's something you could bring out,
and prove what you're working on.
But with the gray projects, at least the level at which I
worked, there was absolutely no level of proof that you could
bring out of anywhere.
I mean, I could look and look and look, and there was no way I
could bring any proof out of the facility - and that's how they
designed it. They want to have the ability to deny it and not
have any trump card that says, wait a minute, look at this -
whatever proofs you might have.
K: So in terms of the nuts and bolts, I remember the description
- you went into this - it sounded like a trailer. I don't know
if it literally was a trailer, but it was a place that was
compartmentalized in such a way that you were in half of it, and
there was another person, at a monitor, in the other half, and
you basically weren't allowed to talk to anybody. Could you
describe that scenario?
D: Sure. That was at a functioning base, that wasn't at the
training facility. I was doing my actual real job, electronic
intelligence. We had a C-van; it was called a C-van, kind of
like a trailer, but no wheels.
You go into it, and we had two stations in this van. I worked
one station and my partner worked the other station. We couldn't
be in the trailer apart from one another; we both had to be in
the trailer at the same time, because of the... well, we just
had to be in the trailer at the same time. But he had no clue as
to what I was doing with the gray project.
K: So, he wasn't part of the gray project, to your knowledge?
D: No. Well, not to my knowledge, but I have a feeling that I
was probably the only one there that was part of the gray
K: In a sense, you're a psychic.
D: Yeah... I guess you could call me a very, very specialized
K: Okay. Do you have the same abilities - that you had with the
gray aliens that you were communicating with - with humans?
D: Well, that's a question I get posed often, and I always have
to think about it, because... I guess it's possible, if the
other person had the same type of heightened ability, and who
knows? If I had stayed in longer, perhaps it would have migrated
to that level for the training, because at every point in my job
that I was doing with the gray project, it was always training,
that's all I did, was train.
What they told me was that I was training for a particular thing
in the future that was going to happen, and I needed to be up to
snuff, so to speak, and able to do it without any reservations
and without any mistakes.
So, the communications that I was receiving constantly, week in,
week out, and that I would convey through the computer when I
was typing it in to the computer, was all just a test.
Basically, I was just training, training, more training.
Now the initial training at the school was to uncover the
abilities, but then when I went operational at other bases, two
other bases that I did this at, that was training as well.
K: Was that on the job training at that point? I mean, you know,
to put it in those terms. Because at that point, you were
actually in communication with an alien, whereas in the initial
training - maybe you can describe that - there was a flat line,
which you actually were supposed to move around with your mind.
D: The technology obviously came from the ET species that we
were in contact with. At the school, I wasn't communicating with
an ET. It was kind of like a biofeedback machine, but on a
totally different level, because I wasn't connected to the
machine at all. It started out by having these boxes on a
computer screen and had an oscilloscope straight line for each
one of the boxes, and I was told to concentrate on a tone that
was being played in my ear on the headphones, and the
instructions were to immensely hum this tone.
That is a hard thing to do - to mentally hum. You're humming yet
it is not vocal and it's in your mind, but they said that is
what you have to concentrate on, to mentally hum.
So, I would mentally hum this particular tone they would be
playing in my earphones, and then at some point I started to
sense that the line I was looking at when I was doing this was
connected in my mind somehow and that I could move it, but it
It took several days for me to even... and that was just
torture, you know, three or four hours of just sitting there
mentally humming something for a couple of days without any
sense that something was actually going to happen.
I'm thinking someone was going to jump out of a closet again and
say, “I can't believe you have been mentally humming this tone
for three days!”
But, anyway, I did it and as I write in the book, it's kind of
like a sense of clicking. It wasn't an audible click, but it was
like when you're up against this force and then all of a sudden
the force gives way and you can move your hand against that
force, and you can move your hand quicker because the force has
been taken away.
That's kind of how it felt, as this resistance, and then the
resistance gave away.
K: Did it grow, this ability? Once you clicked, was it just
there, or did you feel that there was an advancement that you
D: Oh yeah, definitely an advancement. And it was very, very odd
because once my mind knew how to overcome that little bit of the
resistance to the abilities... it was weird because my mind
automatically knew what to do and so it grew upon itself without
me overtly doing something.
Of course, I was mentally engaged in the exercises that they
gave me, but I could sense that there was this exponential
learning that was going on in my brain. It was just the oddest
feeling and during this time I had these weird dreams. It was a
very odd time mentally.
And then, of course, I was going to my regular school too, at
which I had to keep my grades up; so it was mentally exhausting,
the several weeks I was there. It was an incredible experience,
from the mental standpoint.
K: So going through your regular training actually gave you a
cover story, or gave you a reason to be wherever you were. It's
like the layers of the onion. So, in a sense, if I recall, you'd
go in to do a job and everyone around you would think you were
doing that particular job, you were equipped to do that job but,
in essence you were doing this other job.
D: Yeah, but I had to do that other job too and it was an
K: So you were always doing two jobs?
D: Yeah, at the bases I was at, the two bases - the secret agent
aspect of my life and then a regular Joe aspect of my life.
So, they gave me these elaborate instructions on how the contact
would happen. When you say contact in this context, you could be
talking about a lot of things [laughs] so let's get the right
D: So, that was my human contact within the gray project.
K: So you go to this base, and you sit at the computer and what
happens is that you are communicating or open to communicate
mentally with an ET? We're not sure whether the ET is... did you
actually know if the ET was on earth at the time?
K: Or it could be anywhere?
D: I never knew of any location.
K: Okay. So, the being is almost kind of dictating to you; would
that be correct?
D: Yeah, in our terms, yeah.
K: They just knew that they had a communication channel through
you to get to the military, so to speak?
D: Yeah. I'm convinced that there was a loop there somewhere
because the whole point of me typing it into the computer so
that somebody somewhere could read it, was so that they could
verify the information for accuracy, because that is essentially
what I was doing, just honing in my skills to make sure that I
was accurately conveying the messages that were being relayed to
K: But wasn't it that you actually found out that those messages
were (about) abductions that were happening?
D: It just so happens that some of that information seemed to me
to be information about abductions; and that's the whole problem
with this entire experience. A lot of things just don't make any
sense. I mean, why would they be conveying that type of
information to me?
So maybe at some sort of future event they were going to be
using me to convey this type of information, abduction
information, I have no idea.
But I started to receive information, like you said, that really
correlated to me like it had something to do with abductions,
because there were fields, so to speak, like filling out a form,
there were fields.
Or there were these pieces of information that were a
potentiality for recall, I remember that one; residual pain
levels and latitudes and longitudes... so I mean maybe they
weren't abduction scenarios or abduction information, but it
really seemed to me that it was because of the different bits of
information that were being communicated.
And that was - I guess we're getting ahead of ourselves, but
that was towards the end where I was like, “This is just going
way further than I ever wanted it to.”
And when I got the information about residual pain levels - that
really, really, really hit me - like, “Are there people being
harmed because of this?”
They had a different spectrum with the residual pain levels.
They were forwarded all the way from low digits all the way up
to really high digits, like 100 all the way down to 2 and 3 and
so I was thinking, well, on one end of that spectrum somebody is
getting hurt. Maybe on the other one they aren't getting hurt
but if there is a residual pain level at 2 and there is a
residual pain level at 100, somebody, one of those, is on the
K: So this sounded like it had to be something that was
happening on the planet, so that the military could check
whether or not you were actually being accurate.
K: If it was something off planet they wouldn't necessarily,
theoretically anyway, be able to check it. So it would have to
be on planet.
D: Well, not necessarily because if they have a loop back to the
ETs that I was contacting with, and the ETs told them what the
correct information was then that would complete the loop
regardless of where they were at.
K: Okay, meaning there had to be another communicator in the
loop. Because I'm assuming on some level they wouldn't need you
if they could communicate directly the way I am communicating
D: Exactly. I don't think that was the only way to communicate
This is what was told to me in the meeting that I had, the first
meeting - the whole purpose of this project, Project Preserve
Destiny, was to train these cognitive individuals that would be
able to communicate intuitively; because at some certain event
in the future, that was going to be the only way that we can
communicate; because electromagnetic communications were going
to be disrupted on a world-wide scale.
The only way that the world leaders and military and all these
people who are in charge of the world, so to speak, all these
different countries, different levels of government - the only
way that they would be able to communicate is through this
network of intuitive communicators.
K: And again, we're going to jump ahead a little bit here simply
because we can't sit here and read your book from start to
finish, which I would encourage everyone to do. It's remarkable
in that you don't elaborate or embellish or go off track. You
really just tell the story in a very nuts and bolts fashion.
D: Well, I tell people if I was to make up a story, it would be
a lot more elaborate than this, but I wanted to stick to what
happened to me and let everybody else conjecture upon that;
because if I start conjecturing, then I think it sullies my
credibility, so to speak.
K: You mean, as a witness?
D: Yes, I need to stick to the facts.
K: You developed a relationship, not necessarily with the first
ET that you were communicating with but with the second one. Is
D: Well, when you say relationship, that's kind of a loose term!
We didn't have fireside chats but, what you're referring to is -
at some point, there was a different level of communications
that I stumbled upon, and that's one of the most difficult
things I had to explain in the book, because it is really hard
to describe the nuts and bolts of the communication itself - let
alone another level of the communication.
So, suffice it to say that at some point I discovered this other
level. I got the sense that after his reaction - my ET contact -
after his reaction, I got the sense that that wasn't a monitored
level of communications. I guess it's a moot point; it doesn't
really matter if it was monitored. I felt more comfortable
talking out of line, so to speak, or communicating other than
the official communications that we were conveying.
It was interesting how these communications happened, because
they happened instantaneously. However, again, my conversion of
that conversation had to be converted to real time; which means,
in the human world, we have to start doing something and then we
end doing something, and in between there is a timeframe.
So I would get the communication and then I would start typing
it and he would just hang on the line, so to speak, until I got
done so that if I needed any clarification on something, then I
could ask for clarification.
You know it's funny in retrospect, because at the time that this
was happening I never knew in my wildest dreams that I would
actually be talking about this to somebody. I always thought
that it would be classified and I would never discuss it. So in
retrospect nick-naming them Spock and Bones was probably not the
best thing for my credibility because it looks like I'm
embellishing to make it look funny.
K: Well, that's very poetic. Let's put it that way.
D: Thank you for clarifying that - but the first one was named
Spock because of the logical nature in which the communications
happened. Their emotions were very much based in logic although
they had other emotions too, it was much more logical than our
conversations, so I nicknamed him Spock in my own mind, that's
what I referred to him as.
And then on the second contact at the second base it was a
different ET contact, and so I just went along with the 'Star
Trek' theme and named him Bones, but there was no reason to name
K: Could you see these beings while you were communicating with
them in your mind?
D: No. I believe at one point I tried to convey my desire to see
or to get a visual, but I never got a visual of anything, not of
them. I got visual stimulus, you know, plenty of visual stimulus
but nothing of them. That would have been... again, that's one
of the things in the book that would have been nice to be able
to have drawings and all kinds of nifty stuff, but...
K: Okay, so 'Bones', the second one, comes on the scene, and
you're communicating with him in this normal sort of way that
you have been used to doing, which is receiving communications.
At what point in the length of exposure to this being did you
suddenly reach that place? Can you describe that transition?
D: As I recall, I think it started with Spock, towards the end
of our time together.
K: So even with Spock, you were getting to that?
D: Yeah, I think that's when it started. I can't quite say that
for 100% sure, but I think it was at the end of our contact, at
the time we were contacting one another. I think it was towards
the end of that, but most of that communication was with Bones
because I had discovered it already, and felt more comfortable
by that time. At some point the contact said they were quite
surprised that I would be able to do that, because that's not a
level of communication typically, that intuitive communicators
are capable of. I'm sure they have the ability that they find,
so to speak.
K: What happened then? Can you tell us a little bit about your
dialog with them? Were these communications happening outside of
your work hours?
D: No. Never.
K: Absolutely never?
D: Well, I tried to, at one point but there was no... well, let
me step back a little bit. I did start to receive once, one time
in the dorm, and I told him that I wasn't at work and that I
wasn't at my station and so he signed off. But I think it was
just kind of a clerical error, a mistake or something. He didn't
realize that I wasn't at work. Obviously, they have my schedule
because they would start the communication when I was at work.
K: Okay - but in what you call the informal communication, you
were not communicating this informal dialogue to your superiors,
K: You weren't typing it into the machine?
D: No. If it were a question that I posed to them, then I
wouldn't convey any answers, so to speak; but conversely, I
hardly ever got any answers. So it was kind of a moot point
K: Okay. Well, you had a relationship of sorts with Bones, in
what you were able to ask him questions and he would respond
from time to time.
K: And you felt that it was something of an informal dialogue as
you called it.
K: Can you recall various dialogue points that you had?
D: Sure. There were a lot of impressions that I was left with
regarding our communications and regarding them. I've always
been interested in time and time travel and stuff. So I did try
to pick his brain so to speak, as far as how they travel and how
they got here and how it relates to our time.
What I got was the impression that they do use time to travel,
but not in the sense that we think - where they can go backwards
and forward in time. I asked them about that. I said, “Can we go
backward and forward in time?” The impression I got was you
couldn't go backward and forward in time because time is
So if you go back ten minutes from right now - well, right now
is relative. It's a relative time point, not a solid time point.
So you can't go back from something that's relative to
everything else anyway.
So, what he says is, they could go around time. Now I really
didn't understand that, but he said you go around using
electromagnetic energy. You could go around time.
As I thought about it later... you read about Einstein's theory
that light can bend when it's going by a planet. It will bend
because of the gravitational pull of the planet. I think they
use that gravitational energy, so to speak, to go around time.
I don't think they can go back a half-hour from right now and
experience that time frame. But they do use time in some sort of
way to travel because they do travel long distances, he said.
K: In other words he didn't, then...
Dan Burisch talks about his
relationship with a J-rod. I don't know if you're familiar with
K: ...his relationship with a J-rod called Chi'el'ah - and he
says that Chi'el'ah was a time traveling ET who came back around
the time of Roswell, and that they had a mission. Were you told
by Bones that he came from the future?
D: Well, no. The impression I got regarding time was they
couldn't do that. They couldn't go backward and forward in time.
Now of course, this was an impression I got and it wasn't
something whereby he gave me algorithms and gave me the proof -
you know, that this can't happen and this can't happen - but as
he told me, they use time to travel. They go around time, but
they don't go through time. They don't go backwards and forward
in time. They just use time to travel; which is, they go around
K: Perhaps going around it...
D: Its very difficult...
K: ...maybe they bend it?
D: Yeah that's the impression that I got is that they bend time.
K: They bend time.
D: I don't know what the practical application of that is
K: Yeah, obviously we're not physicists here.
D: [Laughing] Yeah, exactly.
K: But if you bend time - certainly if I bend something, and
I've got a line, and over here is 2012 and over here is 1920 -
if I bend time and bring them together, I'm going from 2012 to
1920 or visa versa. In a sense I am traveling through time.
K: But I'm bending it.
K: So I understand maybe...
D: There could well be very specific things that he was talking
about related to their particular abilities. Perhaps some other
ET species has different abilities, I don't know. He did convey
that they did use it for traveling.
K: Okay... and what about the crafts? Did they tell you anything
about their crafts - how they were propelled, et cetera?
D: No. No, just electromagnetic energy and time, that's what I
got from him. I did ask him about God and the whole religion
aspect of how it relates to them and us. He said that we are
created. He said 'we' as in them and us. The 'we' aspect was
generic - both of us, instead of saying 'we' as in them, it was
in the context of all of us.
He said that we are created; we are of the same creation. He
said there are two creations. One is the intelligent creation,
and one is the non-intelligent creation. We, them and us, are
part of the same intelligent creation.
Now he didn't say, he didn't specify any religions or anything
like that. He just said that we are part of the same creation.
We're all created, which I thought was very interesting from an
ET aspect of it, because you wouldn't think that an ET would
admit to... because of their higher level of intelligence. A lot
of people think that they created us.
K: So that's what you were told, that this particular group you
represented was not responsible for creating us.
D: No, he didn't say that but he said that we are part of the
same creation, which would lead me to believe that they did not
create us, but we are all created.
K: Did you ask him about Jesus?
D: I did.
K: Lots of people like to say that Jesus was an ET, or a partial
D: Yeah, I never got any information regarding anything related
to Jesus, or a specific religion or anything.
K: Okay, how did you know what species of ET he was, or did you
K: In other words, did your superiors say you're going to be
talking to a Gray?
K: Or he could have been Nordic for all we know.
D: [laughing] Yeah, you know, I don't even keep up on the
different species so I have absolutely no clue. They had
nicknames for the Grays or one of them was Gray. It's actually
called the Gray Project that we worked on. They also called them
'slant' missions, and I don't exactly know what or how that
relates; but it is referred to as the 'missions'. If you're on a
gray mission, it's called a slant mission, so I don't know how
that relates to the species. I was never told anything relating
to a specific species.
K: How long did your communication with Bones - with the
informal nature of it - go on?
D: Well, it was pretty much the whole time we were
communicating, which I think was probably around 10 months or
K: Okay - so in ten months time you must have asked him a lot of
D: Well yeah, I tried to. You know a lot of times the
communications would happen, and as time went on I got better at
the communications and Bones knew that, so he didn't stay on as
long for the clarification. So I would really have to be quick
with my question, if I had a question.
It's kind of like having a relationship with your grandfather
over the course of two or three years. Then five years later
there's someone asking, “Well, what did your grandpa think about
political issues?” You're, “Well, grandpa was conservative,” or
“grandpa was”... So you don't remember an exact conversation
exactly about what he said. But you get this sense of the
answers over time because you know based on the conversations
So when I revealed the things that I've learned from them it's
not word for word you know, exact quotes. It's the impression I
got after asking them 3 or 4 times in a particular area and so
its my reporting of my impressions of what they've communicated
to me over the span of the 2 years that I did this.
K: At some point you developed a sort of a conscience about what
you were doing.
K: And I'm going to assume this impacted why you left in the end
D: Uh huh.
K: But you must have asked him about the abductions?
D: Yeah I did, and I never got any answers for that, never. It
was just communication and then he was gone.
K: Okay - in the abductions, you said you got latitudes and
longitudes. What was the implication? Were people being abducted
all over the planet on a regular basis? Are you able to tell
us... was there more mass abductions? Were there mass abductions
and where did they happen?
D: Well, I mean I didn't get hundreds of them, you know, I maybe
got a couple dozen or three dozen or something like that. So it
wasn't a lot of them and to tell you the truth I didn't really,
until maybe had gotten a couple of dozen them or whatever, I
didn't really start thinking, “Well, wait a minute”. It didn't
really start dawning on me until I had received several of them
that this might be something that is odd.
Then right toward the end - and that's probably why I stopped
getting them is because I started to ask my handler about them.
“What's this, what is this information? It seems like abductions
and it seems like there's pain,” you know that type of thing.
The answer I always got back from the handler was, “Just
communicate what you're told, what is being communicated to you.
Just communicate that to us and don't ask questions. You're not
here to ask questions. You're here to practice your ability”.
So then you know, then I got frustrated and of course there's a
lot of other things going on with my personal life. I didn't
want to be there anymore. I mean I didn't want to have this
going on in my life anymore because it was affecting my personal
I couldn't get close to people because I didn't want to talk
about things. I mean I was just having a lot of psychological
issues with having this type of job because it was isolating me
from the world, in my mind at the time. I mean maybe I would
have worked through that but... .
K: So, Project Preserve Destiny... what is the objective of that
project to your knowledge?
D: Yes. As it was told to me when I was briefed into the project
at the school, there is going to be some sort of event in the
future that is going to wipe out all the electromagnetic energy.
Now I don't know if that's a temporary knockout or a permanent
knockout or semi-permanent, or whatever. I don't know that.
But he said there's going to be some sort of event, and that
this group of individuals, of intuitive communicators, were
going to be the communications conduit for world leaders, and
they're going to be strategically placed all around the world so
that they can convey the communications, and they can convey
what that communication is to the people around them or whoever,
the leaders or whoever.
K: In other words, they're the only ones who are going to be
able to communicate with the ETs and then to the humans in the
military, because it certainly isn't just human-to-human. It's
D: Well, that's kind of the wild card that I don't know. I don't
think I stayed long enough in order to find out the different
methods this might take, you know, or the different channels.
K: But you were communicating with an alien or an ET so it had
to involve ET communication.
D: Well, that's the assumption.
K: Have you been brought back into the military or have you been
interviewed, like I'm interviewing you? Have you been asked to
give, I don't know, a download as to what really happened
because at this point you're outside the military? You've
written a book. The military is interested in all this because
they brought you in, in the beginning. So are you at liberty to
say if this has happened?
D: Well... no, I haven't been contacted by the government, but I
will say that at one time I was on the phone with a producer
from a really, really popular radio show, like one of the top
two in the nation.
After I got off the phone with the producer I got a call on my
cell phone. I got a call from somebody and it said, “Don't take
it any further!” or some terminology that said “Stop this
pursuit!” and then just hung up.
I was like, I sat there for five minutes thinking, “How in the
world... ? I don't understand this!” Because I was on the phone
with this producer, and it wasn't more than thirty seconds or a
minute after I got off the phone with this producer that I got
that phone call.
That was the only thing that has even happened in all the
communications I have had, all the conferences that I have done,
and all this stuff, the book. I've never gotten any type of
communication from the government and I just got that phone
call. Who knows, it might have been the producer calling me back
and just trying to scare me as a joke or something. I don't
know, but it was quite odd.
That's what was unusual about it, because I was on my cell phone
with the producer and the landline that I was at, at the time,
called. That's why I though it was weird because if it were the
cell phone then maybe I would think that somebody was...
K: Somebody calling you back.
K: Obviously tapping your communications. I mean why wouldn't
they? Now you're an electronics expert, are you not?
D: Well, in a very, very limited capacity with what I was doing
in the military. Yeah, I knew a lot about it.
K: Okay, so you must know about surveillance techniques and...
K: ...what they have at their disposal. And you must be
conscious, I mean even as a telepath to some degree, you must
know that you're being monitored?
D: Oh, yeah. When I first released the book I did it in a way
that if there was going to be some sort of interesting activity
from the government when I released it, that they really
couldn't do anything about it.
I sent it to one of the largest websites at the time and this
was 1997, so the web wasn't as big as it is today, obviously,
but there was a site called 'ufomind.com' and Glenn Campbell -
he lives in Las Vegas or somewhere around there - was running
I don't know where it is now or how big it is now, but it was
the biggest UFO related, alien related type of site. I sent the
manuscript to him and then we released the book. So I wanted it
to be out there in the public with somebody before it actually
So anyway, right after I wrote the book I sent some pictures to
a UFO magazine in England. A lady editor named Georgina Bueller,
or something like that. Anyway, I sent it to her. She said she
sent them back - I never got them back.
They were very interesting pictures. They were the pictures of
one of the bases I was stationed at. I'm absolutely positive
that somebody did not want those pictures to continue to be
copied. But they were published in the UFO magazine that month.
Anyway, those are the only two scenarios that I've come across.
If you think about it though, they have no incentive to do
anything to silence me - because if they do something, then that
just brings a certain level of press or whatever to the
situation because something has been done about what I'm saying.
If you don't do anything about what I'm saying, then its kind of
lumped in with all the other, you know, loonies or whoever else
is out there talking about aliens and things.
D: I think their concern was: am I going to have any evidence?
And of course I had absolutely no evidence of the Gray Project.
So to them its like you know, whatever.
K: You could just be a nutcase out there.
K: But on top of it I mean I have to say you've kept a pretty
low profile. You live in a kind of an obscure area, excuse me
for saying that...
K: ...but it is...
K: ...you know, to some degree.
K: And some of the people in the UFO circuit, if you will, are
pretty flamboyant and out there, and constantly...
D: High profile, yeah.
K: ...seen around and what not. You are kind of low profile.
D: Well, you know, it's interesting - because what lends my
story a higher degree of credibility is that I'm not a typical
person like you just said, like they see on the UFO circuit.
I've spoken at conferences, but I don't fit in at those
conferences. I've done a lot of press - and what I found is I am
a very different person from most of the people in the UFO world
in that I have conservative ways and most people have a more
free lifestyle, or are more liberal or whatever.
If this hadn't happened to me and somebody told me the story,
you know, with just my own background and everything, I would
say that they're just lunatics.
So it's very interesting...
K: Yeah, it is.
D: ...that this person here has experienced what he has
experienced, and that would be the only thing that would make me
a believer, is me experiencing it. Otherwise, I probably
wouldn't be as believing of this world or this you know, stuff
happening in this world.
But definitely, it's real - because
I've experienced it.